Inside St. Louis County’s Predatory Night Courts

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'It’s Racist As Hell': Inside St. Louis County’s Predatory Night Courts

ST. LOUIS COUNTY, MISSOURI — In 2004, Sean Bailey recalls, he was driving through the streets of St. Louis County en route to a party, when he saw a familiar black-and-white car out of the corner of his eye. He reached for his phone to warn the friend he was following to slow down, but it was too late; the cop blared his siren and pulled up behind him. Bailey, who had a warrant stemming from a failure to appear in court for unpaid traffic tickets, felt a familiar pang of anxiety. He knew exactly what was going to happen next.

“I was like, I’m going to get into this little orange jumpsuit and sit in this cold cell for a couple of days here,” the bespectacled St. Louis, Missouri native recalls, lighting a cigarette and blowing out a thin ribbon of smoke.

The officer ran Bailey’s name and discovered he had a warrant. Bailey was arrested and sent to jail in Florissant, a municipality in northern St. Louis County bordering Ferguson. When Bailey stepped inside his cell, he was greeted with a gust of cold air. It was chilly outside — maybe 20 degrees, he speculates — “and they had the AC blasting.” The interior was grimy, and “there were a lot of guys in there, beating on the cells and calling for [help] and nobody was coming.”

Attachment 2785

Attachment 2784
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After standing in line for a few minutes we shuffle into a building that doesn’t look like a traditional courthouse. In Florissant, court is located in a massive gym; it used to be in an actual courtroom, but the room was small enough that anyone who wasn’t on the docket was barred from entering. Until June, when the presiding judge of the St. Louis County Circuit Court demanded that municipal courts open their doors to the public, this was common practice, the Dispatch reported. Some courts told defendants who showed up with their kids that children weren’t allowed in the building.

After the judge’s order, Florissant moved its court to a gym, which accomplished the goal of allowing everyone inside the courtroom, but makes it impossible to hear the court’s proceedings: the room is huge and the judge has a penchant for muttering. The court now seems to be straddling the line between “open” and “closed.” You can go inside, but you can’t hear anything that’s going on. [More/source]

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Related:

• ‘It’s Racist As Hell': Inside St. Louis County’s Predatory Night Courts
• The Most Racist City In America: St. Louis?
• St. Louis aka Rome of the West

Solutions:

1. Study law and history: contracts, administrative court proceedings, debt collection, etc.
2. Study accounting especially GAAP and CAFR
3. Throw the TV to the curb
4. Study juries and jury nullification.
5. Get more involved in voting and the voting process.
6. Study commerce/trade, investing, and trading.
7. Deep dive into Lex Mercatoria (Law Merchant).

Bottom line, their problems are economic. They will need to do for self rather than look to government for aide.

"5. Get more involved in voting and the voting process."

Is this sarcasm? The few politicians that want to tell the truth and or help the people end up in jail or dead.

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Originally Posted by pumpkin

"5. Get more involved in voting and the voting process."

Is this sarcasm? The few politicians that want to tell the truth and or help the people end up in jail or dead.

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Let's look at this from the perspective of African-Americans.

African-Americans have been tortured, beaten, and killed for the mere act of voting in these United States. If they are to participate in that process, they should get into the mechanics of how it works and truly leverage it to their benefit.

Myself personally, I would find better things to do, but to suggest to African-Americans not to vote given the sacrifices their and my (our) ancestors made for it would be sacrilege to most of them.

You do raise a good point, however. They would be better served studying money and commerce (with accompanying practice) rather than voting.

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Originally Posted by shikamaru

Let's look at this from the perspective of African-Americans.

African-Americans have been tortured, beaten, and killed for the mere act of voting in these United States. If they are to participate in that process, they should get into the mechanics of how it works and truly leverage it to their benefit.

Myself personally, I would find better things to do, but to suggest to African-Americans not to vote given the sacrifices their and my (our) ancestors made for it would be sacrilege to most of them.

You do raise a good point, however. They would be better served studying money and commerce (with accompanying practice) rather than voting.

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You know shikamaru, the more I study law, I have come to see some advantages in the "central banking scheme". For instance by creating the Trust Accounts - 14 Amendment persons, men and women of color were given a more level playing field. Women too. So I can see your point. There is always some good and some bad [pros and cons].

I think if many men and women of color began to understand law and inheritance, then they would most likely just become more and more angry and upset. I hate systems of slavery, any slavery be it mind or physical. But one must admit that the central banking scheme is a way to give all peoples opportunity.

I wonder how long mankind will suffer [allow] borders to exist between races, cultures. "Imagine no possessions, I wonder if you can, no need for greed or hunger, a brotherhood of man"... John Lennon

Did you ever notice that one inherits in SURNAME? Tell me what was Jesus' surname? Did he affiliate himself with any nation-state? Nation-State philosophy begs purely a Love being birthed out of FAITH. For at once it begs the Faith and Credit of the people who consent to its existence. But there is another path. One which begs a higher consciousness. That of Faith being born out of LOVE. In the latter existence, God consciousness is realized in man whereof man himself is the living Temple of God. In the former, man holds God to be without himself, in the latter, Within.

The problems will continue until a new consciousness takes root. For the problems cannot be resolved by the same consciousness that caused them.

Consider in the central banking scheme slavery of one people is substituted with slavery for all.

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Originally Posted by Michael Joseph

You know shikamaru, the more I study law, I have come to see some advantages in the "central banking scheme". For instance by creating the Trust Accounts - 14 Amendment persons, men and women of color were given a more level playing field. Women too. So I can see your point. There is always some good and some bad [pros and cons].

I think if many men and women of color began to understand law and inheritance, then they would most likely just become more and more angry and upset. I hate systems of slavery, any slavery be it mind or physical. But one must admit that the central banking scheme is a way to give all peoples opportunity.

I wonder how long mankind will suffer [allow] borders to exist between races, cultures. "Imagine no possessions, I wonder if you can, no need for greed or hunger, a brotherhood of man"... John Lennon

Did you ever notice that one inherits in SURNAME? Tell me what was Jesus' surname? Did he affiliate himself with any nation-state? Nation-State philosophy begs purely a Love being birthed out of FAITH. For at once it begs the Faith and Credit of the people who consent to its existence. But there is another path. One which begs a higher consciousness. That of Faith being born out of LOVE. In the latter existence, God consciousness is realized in man whereof man himself is the living Temple of God. In the former, man holds God to be without himself, in the latter, Within.

The problems will continue until a new consciousness takes root. For the problems cannot be resolved by the same consciousness that caused them.

Consider in the central banking scheme slavery of one people is substituted with slavery for all.

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The "central banking scheme" has been with us for a very long time .... since the inception of Babylon. Adopted by the Romans and the Jews.

At some point, African-Americans will need to realize that their solutions lie outside of Babylon, its mystery systems (government being but one of them), and Mammon.

Trust law is another area of study to add to the list.

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Originally Posted by shikamaru

The "central banking scheme" has been with us for a very long time .... since the inception of Babylon. Adopted by the Romans and the Jews.

At some point, African-Americans will need to realize that their solutions lie outside of Babylon, its mystery systems (government being but one of them), and Mammon.

Trust law is another area of study to add to the list.

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I will choose my words very carefully because I do not mean any harm but this is a very sensitive subject as in fact some men have seized and sold other men and that of course is horrible. Consider that one day it dawns on a man that God is not American, Chinese, Babylonian, Egyptian, or even Judean.

God is not a man and we are informed that God is not a respecter of persons. Identity is key. How does one identify one's self? I chose to not call myself American or any other subset of American such as European American etc, etc. Fact is when Christ formed in me, I could no longer identify with a particular tribe or nation-state. I can no longer ask God to bless America at the expense of other peoples.

I can't sit back and watch bombs being dropped on other people as if watching a video game. Every time I see such a travesty I consider instead of those poor children being foreign to America what if they were little white boys and girls. I hope not to get involved with a race discussion and I only offer the foregoing in the light of unity. Fact is, my heart mourns for all peoples who are oppressed.

Remember shikamaru it is only the diligent seeker who finds. And one must seek with all their heart/mind to find. I watched last week as a poor man [unfortunately he related he was African American] stood before a judge for the simple matter of an expired registration sticker. The poor man in shabby clothing related that he had resolved the matter and had witness of the same. Without thinking the judge said "court cost and fine is $361". The poor man related that the requested fee was more than he made in a week and that he only had $200. The judge said "come back when you have the $361 and we can settle this matter."

Where is mercy? Where is compassion? It seems a ruthless beast MIND has arisen out of apathy and greed. Remember that no effect was ever changed absent the understanding of the causes which promoted said effect. Knowledge and Wisdom cannot be ruled by ignorance. It is a sad affair. I wish I could turn back time so that I might give that man the money he needed. It seemed that on that day, I had my own problems to deal with as with everyday.

So I went home and read the entire traffic code including the incorporated Fines associated with the Statute. And I found something very interesting. The Fine's shown were expressed as "implied consent". And there it is. Implied Consent begs a confidence placed or a trust reposed.

Now begging a trust, is there any evidence of implied or express trust? I refuse to understand the central banking scheme expressed as Federal Reserve Banking. I will not subject myself to privilege when I have by right. Nevertheless, I might die to myself in love to another who remains ignorant.

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Originally Posted by Michael Joseph

God is not a man and we are informed that God is not a respecter of persons. Identity is key. How does one identify one's self? I chose to not call myself American or any other subset of American such as European American etc, etc. Fact is when Christ formed in me, I could no longer identify with a particular tribe or nation-state. I can no longer ask God to bless America at the expense of other peoples.

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I just read the bold today in some other material.

Synchronicity is at work here. Good stuff.

Its like with what Morgan Freeman said: "Stop calling me black and I'll stop calling you white." Or something like that. One of the hugest crisis among so-called "African-Americans" is that they are #1 not Africans and they probably would do best if they stopped calling themselves "Black" etc., stop wearing labels that are hostile and undermining. When one allows an adversary to define one's self-identity, is that anything other than slavery?

A visible legality is being poor a black poor a white poor is poor Morgan and Mike Wallace are a exception or just a visible legality as they are wealthy can a poor man blame a black rich man for poverty' poor men cant blame life on rich men. BELFAST Catholics hate protestant no

https://youtu.be/Me6Q2o-DtJ0A BELFAST Catholics hate protestant novisible legality is being poor a black poor a white poor is poor Morgan and Mike Wallace are a exception or just a visible legality as they are wealthy can a poor man blame a black rich man for poverty' poor men cant blame life on rich men.yet how is it a poor man never blames another poor man for life

IMO, voting gives one the false impression of doing something to make change. One can make much more progress when they stop and realize that who is in what office should be completely irrelevant to them, their property and their rights. All men and women need to also realize that they are controlled by division. They are left pointing fingers at one another when in fact, in almost all cases, they are not the cause of each others problems. Government was tied directly to commerce, yet it has escaped the bond and now prays directly on the substance of the people. That is where all our problems begin.

There is a tale in the Bible about a priest named Balaam at Number 22. This certain priest was hired by a king named Balak. I am now going to speak to the external meaning of the story without regard to the internal meaning in man's consciousness. Basically, this Balak called on Balaam to place Balaam under hire. Balak proposed to pay Balaam huge sums of wealth [riches] for the hire.

The Job: King Balak was being plagued by a great people [Israel] and he was very concerned that this great people might turn on his kingdom should there be a cause. So Balak wanted to weaken Israel considerably so that the nation-state Israel might not be able to cause Balak's kingdom any worry. So in a nutshell Balak hired Balaam to curse Israel. This is a very important part of the tale to comprehend. One party hired another party to effect a curse upon a third party.

Balaam is all to ready to go to his new opportunity [gig] so he gets up early and heads out to obtain his riches. What is interesting is that every time Balaam tries to curse Israel he is not allowed. Now before anyone gets lost in the tale in thinking that he or she is not a member of the tribes of Israel, consider that in the tale Israel stands for every man and woman. So now lets continue.

Balaam tries three times to curse Israel and all three times he is twarted and king Balak is more than a bit upset about Balaam's performance. It seems Balaam has taken the wealth and has not performed. So then Balaam understanding that Divine Law prevents him from cursing another figures a work around.

Tangent: The foregoing is VERY IMPORTANT to comprehend in terms of our own liabilities and life. It is my belief that the foregoing relates that man himself by and thru his own deeds brings a self indictment upon his own head in his IMPLIED or EXPRESS consent in deed. Therefore, in deed, man places himself under judgment. Now Divine Law governs the Universe and beyond and therefore can never be destroyed. The Word has been given and cannot be annulled.

For instance, he who bears false witness concerning a matter brings double the judgement upon his own head. It matters not what man's law relates, Divine Law will not be thwarted. continuing....

So here is what Balaam taught Balak. He taught Balak to place a "stumbling block" in front of Israel and should each man or woman choose to engage in activity that is repugnant to Divine Law then ISRAEL WOULD CURSE ITSELF. That is to say that each man or woman by their own deed brings a self indictment upon their own head. In the tale we read where Balak decided to throw a Keg Party whereby he brought in the beer and the wine, the girls in mini-skirts and no doubt some rock n roll music. Which is just another analogy for the stumbling block spoken of previously.

We read in the tale that not only were the "common" folk seduced by king Balak's enticement, but the princes as well. Therefore from the Head to the Foot the whole body became sick. But notice they cursed themselves! Now instead of reading "Toga Party" think about religious Church-State systems and you will begin to get a hint. How can I say this? Well notice did Jesus sing sweet lullabies in Church or did his entire life consist of tearing down the religious church-state? Dear reader it was the latter. And in fact Jesus called the so called leaders of his day - BLIND GUIDES.

And Jesus further said that the "blind lead the blind and they both end up in the ditch." Consider carefully the stumbling blocks of the "blind guides". Only you can curse you! And Divine Law does not respect persons. So Divine Law does not contemplate should and should not rather what you can and can't do.

Now go to the priestcraft of Statehood. Again it is a lie to consider a separation of church and state. Consider that Law begs a Consent of its Use. Law is a benefit for man. To make its Use IMPLIES consent. And this system is based in FAITH first. But Faith while good is not best.

There is better than Faith. For the greatest is Love. Love acts not in duty but even in sacrifice. In Faith, we can see the curses of duty conveyed upon an office in usage. For FIRST the Use is created awaiting one who will act upon the benefit of the Use. One reposing a confidence in another is ONE WHO TRUSTS. Therefore one who trusts benefits from the confidence but that one freely consents.

One may not be forced to trust. That is the lesson in Balaam/Balak. Trust must effect in Consent. Consider now a political society or for that matter a nation-state. These organizations require the consent of the men and women who might benefit under the "shade of that tree". The tree however is an ARTIFICIAL MAN.

The moral of the tale is simple. Consider carefully whereof your trust is lodged. Your trust is valuable. If you don't believe me concerning said value - consider the Full Faith and Credit clause in the Contract between the United States and the States.

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Furthermore, within Padelford the United States is clearly dictating to the States as the following quotes come from Padelford:

“But the States, by the exercise of the taxing power, can take from their inhabitants every cent the inhabitants can spare, and live.

The principle comes to this: that the States, in making the Constitution, intended to give up the power of self-preservation.

On the one hand, then, Congress may convert the General Government into a dictator; on the other, the States have not retained the power of self-preservation. This is McCulloch vs. Maryland.

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One cannot accept a benefit absent an obligation. Thusly to accept the benefit is to also incur the liability.

Now one who assumes an office of trust does so with the blessing of those who placed he/she in office. It is a sacred office. Nevertheless, it is a travesty when man allows greed to trespass upon trust. If the head is sick then the body will rebel. If the body rebels, then their is no trust relationship. The Trust Entity remains as it may be irrevocable however clearly if the heads are steeped in misdeeds [bribes, usury, etc], then what hope of the common private man who just desires peace?

Seems there is a SCHISM. And man is left seeking for the good but using the same consciousness that CAUSED the problem in attempt to solve the problem. The Bible hints at a time when the "people" will become so upset that they will throw their leaders out in the street, and well, you figure it out. Is it no wonder that the so called leaders are afraid? Have you ever noticed how the police act these days? They are just as afraid as you are when a traffic stop occurs.

Fear stagnates. What is left is force. Now consider the words of Jesus. "These take the Kingdom of God by Force". Many will carry around their fifty pound Bible without regard to nature and the things created. However, consider again. At Romans 1:20....

Romans 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Man had best start going to church in Nature to learn of God. For instance look at the Earth. The West is Intellectual the East is Spiritual and the North is FROZEN. Consider how Israel camped in the West is Ephraim [Intellect] in the East is Judah [Spirit]. And man does not consider God. Therefore the BLIND GUIDES leave the pleasant portion desolate!

And thusly, we see Pilate arguing with Truth asking - "What is Truth". What a shame.

Jeremiah 12:10 Many pastors have destroyed my vineyard, they have trodden my portion under foot, they have made my pleasant portion a desolate wilderness.

Jeremiah 12:11 They have made it desolate, and being desolate it mourneth unto me; the whole land is made desolate, because no man layeth it to heart.

Jeremiah 17:5 Thus saith the LORD; Cursed be the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the LORD.

Jeremiah 17:6 For he shall be like the heath in the desert, and shall not see when good cometh; but shall inhabit the parched places in the wilderness, in a salt land and not inhabited.

Jeremiah 17:7 Blessed is the man that trusteth in the LORD, and whose hope the LORD is.

Jeremiah 17:8 For he shall be as a tree planted by the waters, and that spreadeth out her roots by the river, and shall not see when heat cometh, but her leaf shall be green; and shall not be careful in the year of drought, neither shall cease from yielding fruit.


What do you expect of those you place your trust in? Do you require of them to acknowledge the Ever Living God? Or will you just allow them to throw off those bonds so that the system is understood in bottomry - insurance?

Question: Who understands the insurance companies?

Psalms 2:2 The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the LORD, and against his anointed, saying,

Psalms 2:3 Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us.


Now consider yourself. Is there an internal struggle or are you at peace? Does your lower mind submit to the Higher Mind so that you are not divided in Will and Thought? Simply put, do your thoughts serve you or are they as Wild Bulls which jump the fence and trample in the neighbors pasture?

What will you do in the face of such clear cronyism of those in certain clubs? Is it okay to let a few good buddies run the show at the expense of the poor and the ignorant? Or are you willing to say no to such blatant misuse of office. Has anyone noticed that most officials these days are lawyers? Is that more efficient or not? You tell me.

Divine Law cannot ever be broken. It is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow.

Make it a GREAT day!
Michael Joseph

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“But the States, by the exercise of the taxing power, can take from their inhabitants every cent the inhabitants can spare, and live.

The principle comes to this: that the States, in making the Constitution, intended to give up the power of self-preservation.

On the one hand, then, Congress may convert the General Government into a dictator; on the other, the States have not retained the power of self-preservation.

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The justice is somewhat being 'coy' at that part of the case. The case goes further to toss the notion aside as nonsensical, to assert that Congress can make whatever laws it wants but they would be void if in conflict with the Constitution and the obvious intent of the framers and yet still goes goes further to reject the idea that SCOTUS could issue an order that the Supreme Court of Georgia had to obey. Constitution of United States was for federal citizens and federal subjects. District of Columbia is a "State" but not one of the several states. The Articles of Confederation are still in effect. So yes, who or what you put your trust in is important.

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Originally Posted by pumpkin

IMO, voting gives one the false impression of doing something to make change. One can make much more progress when they stop and realize that who is in what office should be completely irrelevant to them, their property and their rights. All men and women need to also realize that they are controlled by division. They are left pointing fingers at one another when in fact, in almost all cases, they are not the cause of each others problems. Government was tied directly to commerce, yet it has escaped the bond and now prays directly on the substance of the people. That is where all our problems begin.

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There is such a thing as a "vote of no confidence". If they had them in the USA (and maybe they do), there would be a lot they wouldn't have been able to get way with likely. A vote of no confidence can be used to completely oust an administration and install another suitable. Ever follow Italian elections and politics?

One potential snafu with voting could be where voters are held as "accommodation party" without any substantial power (like cosigners who have liability to pay but don't necessarily have right to enjoy the automobile).

Related:

• Vote of No Consequence: Does it matter if the Senate has confidence in Alberto Gonzales?
• The U.S. and the Lack of a Vote of No Confidence (thread on a forum)
  A Vote of No Confidence Is In Order

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Originally Posted by allodial

One potential snafu with voting could be where voters are held as "accommodation party" without any substantial power (like cosigners who have liability to pay but don't necessarily have right to enjoy the automobile).

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EXACTLY! Remember the "Rock the Vote" campaign where entertainers went out to solicit the vote of the mentally dead? I suppose the cause is valid to encourage political activism in youth but in reality the youth vote for who they are told to vote. Very few are free thinkers and most are as sponges soaking up the non-sense that entertainers are paid to propound.

To REGISTER is to be affiliated [or to assign to one's self the paternity of a bastard] with the political society. It is expressed trust. To actually vote is implied trust. A voter understands the political society he/she helped to form.

The unity expressed by pumpkin is either expressed in an ARTIFICIAL MAN or is real and living. Enter the Law Merchant stage left. Ugghhhh.

Commercial law could be summed up as being customs and rules for short-form court process (ala Court of the Exchequer). Laborers (manufacture, piloting an aircraft, etc.) are not merchants. Merchants do not manufacture they sell and buy things that others make which is why they can be regulated they are always trustees/warehousemen. The Commerce Clause does not necessarily extend to artificers, laborers or manufacturers.

I've sat in many a soup kitchen, laid in my share of gutters. with poor folks that are know more white or black or catholic or protestant than Poor a common anguish in a black face or a white face put on a Jew face for CBS History month sorry Mike the shortest month was given to black anguish faces are governed races not just tribes and faces a bible story is what anguish faces to this day cope with the meek are inherent bye default .MJ when a racist needs a race what better than a month to celebrate i would love poor white trash month but every month is the same no need too stop being poor in Feb for educated poor black faces the courts and the cops have Faces and are as cruel in Feb as March u break a Man like a horse. Christ lives in every face of anguish and its time to follow his groove and put some Christ up in those blank government faces remind them the men and women just have a person but God and Christ and Me will enjoy the same impunity as a living soul can afford emotion.A kind Man seeks truth the only reward is wisdom that's written on your heart worn on your sleeve the meek inherit each other be as mild or wild as required to flip the tables. https://youtu.be/0M9kIxR_ePU Anthony Williams and millions like him are changing places or trading places be black or white how is it possible .SSN are black or white if a difference can be made it starts with Christ not with court the whole world is registered meek 7 days a week .the dice the dance a meek birth & meek death who benefits this earth Me and the ones in it.keep the earth and be its dust next time around a kingdom and trust.

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Originally Posted by xparte

I've sat in many a soup kitchen, laid in my share of gutters. with poor folks that are know more white or black or catholic or protestant than Poor a common anguish in a black face or a white face put on a Jew face for CBS History month sorry Mike the shortest month was given to black anguish faces are governed races not just tribes and faces a bible story is what anguish faces to this day cope with the meek are inherent bye default .MJ when a racist needs a race what better than a month to celebrate i would love poor white trash month but every month is the same no need too stop being poor in Feb for educated poor black faces the courts and the cops have Faces and are as cruel in Feb as March u break a Man like a horse. Christ lives in every face of anguish and its time to follow his groove and put some Christ up in those blank government faces remind them the men and women just have a person but God and Christ and Me will enjoy the same impunity as a living soul can afford emotion.A kind Man seeks truth the only reward is wisdom that's written on your heart worn on your sleeve the meek inherit each other be as mild or wild as required to flip the tables. https://youtu.be/0M9kIxR_ePU Anthony Williams and millions like him are changing places or trading places be black or white how is it possible .SSN are black or white if a difference can be made it starts with Christ not with court the whole world is registered meek 7 days a week .the dice the dance a meek birth & meek death who benefits this earth Me and the ones in it.keep the earth and be its dust next time around a kingdom and trust.

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Right the poor in Carnal Flesh are around always. And there are the poor in Spirit. But we can also see those poor by Carnal standards being extremely rich by Spiritual standards.

A Mayor is a Corporation Sole. His ministry is the City of Whatever. God does not send out beggars. Thusly, we can see in the ARTIFICIAL MAN a constant beggar at the gate. We see this too in religion - "God please give me". Look at that Mayor attempting to influence the office of Police Chief with subtle cunning words. It is a shame.

One cannot accept a benefit absent an obligation. Thusly to accept the benefit is to also incur the liability.

This is applicable concerning commercial entities. It does not apply to the people / government trust. The government, it's officers and employees, exist only (in their official capacities) for the benefit of the people which created them (official capacity again) for that very purpose. Your story concerns a king, who had a kingdom. That is a whole different form of government than a republic.

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Originally Posted by pumpkin

IMO, voting gives one the false impression of doing something to make change. One can make much more progress when they stop and realize that who is in what office should be completely irrelevant to them, their property and their rights. All men and women need to also realize that they are controlled by division. They are left pointing fingers at one another when in fact, in almost all cases, they are not the cause of each others problems. Government was tied directly to commerce, yet it has escaped the bond and now prays directly on the substance of the people. That is where all our problems begin.

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You are correct. I agree with you entirely.
This is too big a jump for many to make.

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Originally Posted by pumpkin

One cannot accept a benefit absent an obligation. Thusly to accept the benefit is to also incur the liability.

This is applicable concerning commercial entities. It does not apply to the people / government trust. The government, it's officers and employees, exist only (in their official capacities) for the benefit of the people which created them (official capacity again) for that very purpose. Your story concerns a king, who had a kingdom. That is a whole different form of government than a republic.

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The republic still exists but the "form of government" appears to be a Democracy. For in a Republic the purpose of that form is to protect the Un-Alien-able rights of man against the Majority. But in a Democracy the Majority rules and the individual is but a minority dissenting opinion absent any political influence. Both exist simultaneously. Which one will win out? In my opinion, that depends on the individual.

Answer me this: What obligates one to file a 1040 return?

There is a government for the territories of the United States (established under the Constitution). There were several republics which formed the United States. However, where is the evidence that the U.S. territorial government was ever a republic or that a republican form of government was ever guaranteed to territories of the United States? Maybe that is where RAP and similarly based ideologies fail. How can you restore the "republic" that never was?

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Originally Posted by xparte

https://youtu.be/Me6Q2o-DtJ0A BELFAST Catholics hate protestant ...

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Could it be that kind of hatred is just the same in the USA as anywhere else rather than being limited to Northern Ireland? In contrast to the IRA's activities, where in history did non-Catholic Christians, Bible-believers, Eastern Orthodox Christians or Protestants ever set out for exterminating Roman Catholics? This is not to take sides, but its just interesting even from an outsider perspective. The IRA was established in 1919, right after WWI.

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Originally Posted by allodial

There is a government for the territories of the United States (established under the Constitution). There were several republics which formed the United States. However, where is the evidence that the U.S. territorial government was ever a republic or that a republican form of government was ever guaranteed to territories of the United States? Maybe that is where RAP and similarly based ideologies fail. How can you restore the "republic" that never was?

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Well that's interesting. But what of the oath that all of the Military takes is that just a sham? ....and to the Republic for which it stands....

Reminds me of Shrek...and the Onion scene - Layers.

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Originally Posted by Michael Joseph

Well that's interesting. But what of the oath that all of the Military takes is that just a sham? ....and to the Republic for which it stands....

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There is no such military oath and there never has been. The Pledge of Allegiance has nothing to do with official oaths. There isn't a single mention of the word "republic" in official oaths of the United States.

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"I _____ have, this day, voluntarily enlisted myself, as a soldier, in the American continental army, for one year, unless sooner discharged: And I do bind myself to conform, in all instances, to such rules and regulations, as are, or shall be, established for the government of the said Army." The original wording was effectively replaced by Section 3, Article 1, of the Articles of War approved by Congress on 20 September 1776, which specified that the oath of enlistment read: "I _____ swear (or affirm as the case may be) to be trued to the United States of America, and to serve them honestly and faithfully against all their enemies opposers whatsoever; and to observe and obey the orders of the Continental Congress, and the orders of the Generals and officers set over me by them." CONTINENTAL ARMY OATH - ENLISTED - JUNE 14, 1775

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"I _____, do acknowledge the Thirteen United States of America, namely, New Hampshire, Massachusetts Bay, Rhode Island, Connecticut, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, and Georgia, to be free, independent, and sovereign states, and declare, that the people thereof owe no allegiance or obedience to George the third, king of Great Britain; and I renounce, refuse and abjure any allegiance or obedience to him; and I do swear that I will, to the utmost of my power, support, maintain, and defend the said United States against the said king, George the third, and his heirs and successors, and his and their abettors, assistants and adherents; and will serve the said United States in the office of _____, which I now hold, and in any other office which I may hereafter hold by their appointment, or under their authority, with fidelity and honour, and according to the best of my skill and understanding. So help me God." CONTINENTAL ARMY OATH - OFFICERS - OCTOBER 1776

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"I, _____ do acknowledge the United States of America to be free, independent and sovereign states, and declare that the people thereof owe no allegiance or obedience, to George the third, king of Great Britain; and I renounce, refuse and abjure any allegiance or obedience to him: and I do swear (or affirm) that I will, to the utmost of my power, support, maintain and defend the said United States, against the said king George the third and his heirs and successors, and his and their abettors, assistants and adherents, and will serve the said United States in the office of _____ which I now hold, with fidelity, according to the best of my skill and understanding. So help me God. CONTINENTAL ARMY OATH - OFFICERS - REVISED 1778

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<--Treaty of Paris of 1783 past this point, postliminy in effect, cessation of hostilities between the USA and Great Britain. Territories ceded to the Fed by the states. Northwest Ordinance and Constitution - 1787-->

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First part:

"I, A.B., do solemnly swear or affirm (as the case may be) that I will support the constitution of the United States."

The second part read:

"I, A.B., do solemnly swear or affirm (as the case may be) to bear true allegiance to the United States of America, and to serve them {PLURAL!} honestly and faithfully, against all their enemies or opposers whatsoever, and to observe and obey the orders of the President of the United States of America {SINGULAR}, and the orders of the officers appointed over me." The next section of that chapter specified that "the said troops shall be governed by the rules and articles of war, which have been established by the United States in Congress assembled, or by such rules and articles of war as may hereafter by law be established." GENERAL MILITARY OATH 1789 POST-CONSTITUTION

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"I, _____, appointed a _____ in the Army of the United States, do solemnly swear, or affirm, that I will bear true allegiance to the United States of America, and that I will serve them honestly and faithfully against all their enemies or opposers whatsoever, and observe and obey the orders of the President of the United States, and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to the rules and articles for the government of the Armies of the United States." ANOTHER MODIFICATION (FOR OFFICERS) 1830

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<--CIVIL WAR -- 1862-->

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"I, A.B., do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I have never borne arms against the United States since I have been a citizen thereof; that I have voluntarily given no aid, countenance, counsel, or encouragement to persons engaged in armed hostility thereto; that I have neither sought nor accepted nor attempted to exercise the functions of any office whatsoever under any authority or pretended authority in hostility to the United States; that I have not yielded voluntary support to any pretended government, authority, power, or constitution within the United States, hostile or inimical thereto. And I do further swear (or affirm) that, to the best of my knowledge and ability, I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter, so help me God." MODIFICATION JULY 2, 1862

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Defense of the Constitution of the United States means defense of the unwritten, written and of the structure and makeup thereof.

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I, A.B., do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign or domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. So help me God. MODIFIED MAY 13, 1884

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Again defense of the Constitution, which has a deeper meaning than merely defending the written document.

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"I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God." (Title 10, US Code; Act of 5 May 1960 replacing the wording first adopted in 1789, with amendment effective 5 October 1962).

"I, _____ (SSAN), having been appointed an officer in the Army of the United States, as indicated above in the grade of _____ do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office upon which I am about to enter; So help me God." (DA Form 71, 1 August 1959, for officers.) CURRENT OATH AS OF SEPTEMBER 2015.

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The word republic/Republic fails to appear in any of the official oaths for officers or enlisted men of the United States Army (or for any official oath of the United States). The Organic Laws of the United States of America consists of: the Declaration of Independence, the Articles of Confederation, the Northwest Ordinance and the Constitution for the United States of America. Technically "the Constitution of the United States" is not a document but a term referring to that of which the United States consists --to defend the Constitution of the United States would be to defend the fortitude thereof and thusly to defend, support and uphold the obligation it has to the several states.

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...the Thirteen United States of America, namely, New Hampshire, Massachusetts Bay, Rhode Island, Connecticut, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, and Georgia, to be free, independent, and sovereign states.

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Very significant.

Related:
The Organic Laws of the United States of America

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The Pledge of Allegiance was written in August 1892 by the socialist minister Francis Bellamy (1855-1931). It was originally published in The Youth's Companion on September 8, 1892. Bellamy had hoped that the pledge would be used by citizens in any country.

In its original form it read:

"I pledge allegiance to my Flag and the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

In 1923, the words, "the Flag of the United States of America" were added. At this time it read:

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

In 1954, in response to the Communist threat of the times, President Eisenhower encouraged Congress to add the words "under God," creating the 31-word pledge we say today. Bellamy's daughter objected to this alteration. Today it reads:

"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

Section 4 of the Flag Code states:

The Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag: "I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.", should be rendered by standing at attention facing the flag with the right hand over the heart. When not in uniform men should remove any non-religious headdress with their right hand and hold it at the left shoulder, the hand being over the heart. Persons in uniform should remain silent, face the flag, and render the military salute."

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Note the "Republic" is capitalized. Perhaps its code for the several republics for which it stands? It might be worth noting that by 1892, the Civil War would have started 30 years before.

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Originally Posted by allodial

There is no such military oath and there never has been. The Pledge of Allegiance has nothing to do with official oaths. There isn't a single mention of the word "republic" in official oaths of the United States.







<--Treaty of Paris of 1783 past this point, postliminy in effect, cessation of hostilities between the USA and Great Britain. Territories ceded to the Fed by the states. Northwest Ordinance and Constitution - 1787-->





<--CIVIL WAR -- 1862-->



Defense of the Constitution of the United States means defense of the unwritten, written and of the structure and makeup thereof.



Again defense of the Constitution, which has a deeper meaning than merely defending the written document.



The word republic/Republic fails to appear in any of the official oaths for officers or enlisted men of the United States Army (or for any official oath of the United States). The Organic Laws of the United States of America consists of: the Declaration of Independence, the Articles of Confederation, the Northwest Ordinance and the Constitution for the United States of America. Technically "the Constitution of the United States" is not a document but a term referring to that of which the United States consists --to defend the Constitution of the United States would be to defend the fortitude thereof and thusly to defend, support and uphold the obligation it has to the several states.



Very significant.

Related:
The Organic Laws of the United States of America

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wow that was a great post allodial! hmmm.. definitely something more to consider and research.

thanks for putting that together for us.

Answer me this: What obligates one to file a 1040 return?

IMO, a man's own mind.

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Originally Posted by pumpkin

Answer me this: What obligates one to file a 1040 return?

IMO, a man's own mind.

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Wonderful. I have to first form a BELIEF. Wonderful return. Thank you. I was wondering how to get here without pages of writing.

Ive seen that debated on forums occassionally, but it always seems to peter out since the rules dont support it or mention what to do in any way. In all the time Ive played 40K I have never seen anyone do a morale check for an embarked unit. Have you?