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Thread: Two traffic stops snubbed.

  1. #11
    stoneFree
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    KnowLaw & Osbogosley, thanks for that & congrats on the victories! Yes, afraid I was "easy pickins" for quite some time.

    Regarding ticket errors: The error I noticed was the ticket was written up "62 MPH IN A 15 MPH ZONE" when I'm fairly certain the limit was more than 15. I never raised that as an issue. Just a beginner here but my take is ... the citation error leaves the state/court another out; another avenue out of revealing the true nature of their administrative proceeding. They can say "case dismissed; ticket error. Not because of your wacky ALL CAPS strawman theory."

    Also, David once related an instance of a R4C ticket dismissed and they wrote down something like "dismissed, error on the ticket, not for cause."

  2. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by David Merrill View Post
    A Refusal for Cause would only be based on your God-given unalienable rights and if you identify yourself with the legal name, you show prima facie evidence you have accepted the fiduciary responsibility for the charges against the FULL or LEGAL NAME on the card.

    Okay I see your logic, that makes sense to me.

    My question would then be; Haven't you already taken fiduciary responsibility
    by signing the state document for the Trust?

    Sorry if the question is rudimentary, I appreciate your patience.

    Tom

  3. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    Okay I see your logic, that makes sense to me.

    My question would then be; Haven't you already taken fiduciary responsibility
    by signing the state document for the Trust?

    Sorry if the question is rudimentary, I appreciate your patience.

    Tom
    You might be correct. The other line of thought is that, We can proceed in the name JOHN DOE, we do those prosecutions all the time.

    The point is that this is not a silver bullet. It is quite effective and that makes sense when you shed a certain light on it. The presentment, the Uniform Summons and Complaint and Penalty Assessment says the legal name on it. If you specify to the police officer you are not identifying yourself with the card then there is an error of misnomer.

    A lot of the time the officer will give you a verbal warning when it becomes apparent you are going to be taking this to trial.

    Understand that I just read that post again. I presumed by the State document you meant the driver license. Now I will presume you mean the Presentment, the ticket.

    If you accept the position of fiduciary then yes, you are there. You don't have the right to R4C if you are already the fiduciary. If you are not the fiduciary, then you have three days to consider that contract - the right of refusal. If you identify yourself correctly the police officer has forged a title for you. You have three days to consider whether you accept or not.



    Regards,

    David Merrill.


    P.S. You mentioned this:
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  4. #14
    Sorry for not being clear.

    I was talking about the DL.

    The name of the trust is on the DL (at the top)
    You true name sig is at the bottom (or is it printed, I still don't know)

    If it is signed, then your true name is "signing for" your
    legal name, so my question is isn't that all the same to the state
    from a legal perspective?

    I think what you're saying is the officer is going to write the
    ticket out to LEGAL NAME, because it's at the top.

    But you have true name in the sig, giving you separation
    at court.

    "That ticket is not for me."?

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    Sorry for not being clear.

    I was talking about the DL.

    The name of the trust is on the DL (at the top)
    You true name sig is at the bottom (or is it printed, I still don't know)

    If it is signed, then your true name is "signing for" your
    legal name, so my question is isn't that all the same to the state
    from a legal perspective?

    I think what you're saying is the officer is going to write the
    ticket out to LEGAL NAME, because it's at the top.

    But you have true name in the sig, giving you separation
    at court.

    "That ticket is not for me."?
    It is impossible to arraign you. You R4C on the cause being misnomer. You do not specify because it is a fact, you do not need to teach the court or DA law. If things get serious abate the cause for misnomer.

  6. #16

    My Comprehension of the Matter

    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    My question would then be; Haven't you already taken fiduciary responsibility
    by signing the state document for the Trust?


    The comprehension that formed in my head is that there are two trusts involved in traffic matters:
    1. The express trust that is effected when one holds a DL. The holder of the DL is the trustee. The trustee is obligated to abide by the bylaws of the trust. Those bylaws are defined by the traffic laws of whatever state issues the DL.
    2. The constructive trust that is effected by the LEO that issues the presentment. The issuer of the presentment is the executor. The executor offers the recipient of the presentment to be the fiduciary responsible for settling the charges.
    Now, when trustee of the express trust speeds along at 50 mph in a 30 mph zone, then there is a breach of trust, and therefore the State has been injured. From this injury, an LEO effects a constructive trust.

    Something that I have read repeatedly from Michael Joseph, and have self-determined to be true, is that action implies trust.

    The action of procuring and holding a DL demonstrates an express trust relationship between LEGAL NAME and the State (Axe, I think this is the fiduciary responsibility that you've inquired about).

    The actions of the living soul that made the conscious decision to physically apply for and physically carry (see how consciousness and physical capacity has to be loaned to the non-living trust) the DL demonstrates an implied trust relationship between the living soul and the trust.
    LEGAL NAME expressly trusts in STATE
    True Name implicitly trusts in LEGAL NAME
    Things are slightly different with the constructive trust that is effected when an LEO issues a presentment. If a living soul does not identify him or herself as the LEGAL NAME on the DL, then no trust has been demonstrated! The living soul has not expressly agreed to be responsible for settling the charges against the LEGAL NAME on the presentment. Nevertheless, the LEO still effects a trust, but does so in error. If the living soul's actions do not demonstrate trust in LEGAL NAME for the purposes of effecting a constructive trust, then LEO has no legal grounds to construct a trust! Refusal for Cause is an effective way to serve notice that the living soul refuses the offer to be the fiduciary.

    So my answer to your question is, no. No man or woman has accepted fiduciary responsibility for presentments by way of expressly holding a DL. The express trust associated with the DL is seperate from the constructive trust associated with the presentment.

  7. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    Sorry for not being clear.

    I was talking about the DL.

    The name of the trust is on the DL (at the top)
    You true name sig is at the bottom (or is it printed, I still don't know)
    UCC ยง 3-401. SIGNATURE.

    (b) A signature may be made (i) manually or by means of a device or machine, and (ii) by the use of any name, including a trade or assumed name, or by a word, mark, or symbol executed or adopted by a person with present intention to authenticate a writing.

    This leads me to believe that there is no difference between a cursive or printed name because they both still execute a signature that authenticates the writing. As I understand it, the separation between the LEGAL NAME and the True Name comes by the use of full-caps for the LEGAL NAME and Proper English for the True Name. FULL-CAPS always representing the legal entity or corporation.

    This also raises questions of my own, like, When doing a Refusal for Cause, does it make a difference or is it necessary to sign the True Name "Under Duress"(Reservation of Rights) on the ticket(presentment) or as the "Authorized Representative" for the legal name? Or, would I simply sign First, and Middle and still have grounds to Refuse for Cause on misnomer?
    For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it may cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know the worst and provide for it.
    -Patrick Henry-

  8. #18
    Hi Rock;


    Maybe somebody can help me out finding something I am sure I saved to disk. Somebody brought up a citation from a state's Revised Statutes that actually said that the driver license was not to be used for identification purposes! Did anybody catch that?

  9. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by David Merrill View Post
    It is impossible to arraign you. You R4C on the cause being misnomer. You do not specify because it is a fact, you do not need to teach the court or DA law. If things get serious abate the cause for misnomer.
    Whoa... Thanks David.

    That's what I needed. Don't know why I didn't put that together on my own!

    Quote Originally Posted by Rock Anthony
    The action of procuring and holding a DL demonstrates an express trust relationship between LEGAL NAME and the State (Axe, I think this is the fiduciary responsibility that you've inquired about).

    The actions of the living soul that made the conscious decision to physically apply for and physically carry (see how consciousness and physical capacity has to be loaned to the non-living trust) the DL demonstrates an implied trust relationship between the living soul and the trust.

    LEGAL NAME expressly trusts in STATE
    True Name implicitly trusts in LEGAL NAME

    Things are slightly different with the constructive trust that is effected when an LEO issues a presentment. If a living soul does not identify him or herself as the LEGAL NAME on the DL, then no trust has been demonstrated! The living soul has not expressly agreed to be responsible for settling the charges against the LEGAL NAME on the presentment. Nevertheless, the LEO still effects a trust, but does so in error. If the living soul's actions do not demonstrate trust in LEGAL NAME for the purposes of effecting a constructive trust, then LEO has no legal grounds to construct a trust! Refusal for Cause is an effective way to serve notice that the living soul refuses the offer to be the fiduciary.
    Thanks Buddy! That's awesome, I understand that perfectly! Why can't Michael Joseph just say it that way? (lol...jk MJ)

    Sounds like you have definitely kept up your studies.

    Become powerful you have. (voice of Yoda)

  10. #20
    Senior Member Michael Joseph's Avatar
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    If one shows up and engages the Court - or "signs in" before entering the court - well there you have it. I have seen many a man who r4c'ed a presentment - only to show up before the judge and say "I just want to ensure my constitutional rights are protected". Well there you go. In one case, the Judge asked the poor fella, well, then when do you want to reschedule the trial?

    Who protects a constitutional right? Rights are Property - and the Trustee is with the Legal Title for the Trust Corpus. Therefore to claim Against the Constitution is "Trustee de son Tort". Which will just lead to bigger problems.

    by the way: The Court is being held on the side of the Road. The Trustee is conducting a survey - Name, DOB, DL and Registration? Sounds like a survey to me. And that survey goes directly to his districts - Federal Reserve districts. Do you have rights to be there? Or, are you in that overlay at all. It is all up to you. Do you think to usurp the Trustee or the de-jure officer in the Federal Reserve Districts and SPEAK for the NAME.
    Last edited by Michael Joseph; 03-12-11 at 12:47 PM.
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