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  1. #81
    Senior Member Michael Joseph's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shikamaru View Post
    The interesting aspect concerning gage to me was the presumption it is an income producing asset.

    The income from the asset goes to pay off the mortgage in the case of a vif-gage (live gage, promise).

    Other items that interested me was who held what in terms of title, conveyance, and rights of redemption.
    ASSETS. The property in the hands of an heir, executor, administrator or trustee, which is legally or equitably chargeable with the obligations, which such heir, executor, administrator or other trustee, is, as such, required to discharge, is called assets. The term is derived from the French word assez, enough; that is, the heir or trustee has enough property. But the property is still called assets, although there may not be enough to discharge all the obligations; and the heir, executor, &c., is chargeable in distribution as far as such property extends.

    2. Assets are sometimes divided by all the old writers, into assets enter mains and assets per descent; considered as to their mode of distribution, they are 1egal or equitable; as to the property from which they arise, they are real or personal.

    3. Assets enter maim, or assets in hand, is such property as at once comes to the executor or other trustee, for the purpose of satisfying claims against him as such. Termes de la Ley.

    4. Assets per descent, is that portion of the ancestor's estate which descends to the heir, and which is sufficient to charge him, as far as it goes, with the specialty debts of his ancestor. 2 Williams on Ex. 1011.

    5. Legal assets, are such as constitute the fund for the payment of debts according to their legal priority.

    6. Equitable assets, are such as can be reached only by the aid of a court of equity, and are to be divided,, pari passu, among all the creditors; as when a debtor has made his property subject to his debts generally, which, without his act would not have been so subject. 1 Madd. Ch. 586; 2 Fonbl. 40 1, et seq.; Willis on Trust, 118.

    7. Real assets, are such as descend to the heir, as in estate in fee simple.

    8. Personal assets, are such goods and chattels to which the executor or administrator is entitled.

    9. In commerce, by assets is understood all the stock in trade, cash, and all available property belonging to a merchant or company. Vide, generally, Williams on Exec. Index, h. t.; Toll. on Exec. Index, h. t.; 2 Bl. Com. 510, 511; 3 Vin. Ab. 141; 11 Vin. Ab. 239; 1 Vern. 94; 3 Ves. Jr. 117; Gordon's Law of Decedents, Index, h. t.; Ram on Assets.


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    I find very few Laws or Statutes regarding "personal property" - yet there are many regarding "real property" or "real estate". Therefore why not LET out both the Legal AND Equitable Title to an Asset creating a USE in the Trustee such that the "avails, proceeds and profits" that are DERIVED from said asset become "personal property" to the Beneficial Interest CERTIFICATE HOLDER - bearer or named.

    Property begs a Survey and Survey begs a Boundary [closed] = Trust.


    Psa 2:2 The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the LORD, and against his anointed, saying,
    Psa 2:3 Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us.
    Psa 2:12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him.
    The blessing is in the hand of the doer. Faith absent deeds is dead.

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  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Joseph View Post
    I find very few Laws or Statutes regarding "personal property" - yet there are many regarding "real property" or "real estate". Therefore why not LET out both the Legal AND Equitable Title to an Asset creating a USE in the Trustee such that the "avails, proceeds and profits" that are DERIVED from said asset become "personal property" to the Beneficial Interest CERTIFICATE HOLDER - bearer or named.

    Property begs a Survey and Survey begs a Boundary [closed] = Trust.


    Psa 2:2 The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the LORD, and against his anointed, saying,
    Psa 2:3 Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us.
    Psa 2:12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him.
    Would the USE be vested in the trustee or the beneficiary or it depends based on forum of adjudication (Common Law vs. Equity)?
    The term USE also refers to purpose.

  3. #83
    Senior Member Michael Joseph's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shikamaru View Post
    Would the USE be vested in the trustee or the beneficiary or it depends based on forum of adjudication (Common Law vs. Equity)?
    The term USE also refers to purpose.
    It is like this: the Trustee Undertakes by paying a Grantor and the the Grantor performs by transferring the estate or a portion thereof to the Trustee - this forms the contract whereupon is the basis of Trust. Now then the Use is made in the Trustee for the benefit of another. We have not yet described the other yet have we.

    Sometimes and in fact most times, the Grantor can make an Irrevocable Grant [absent strings attached] and then said man in the office of Grantor then takes the office of Beneficiary. Therefore the USE is made IN TRUST by TRUST AGREEMENT in the Trustee for the Beneficiary.

    And then sometimes the Grant is NOT irrevocable whereby the Grantor may revoke the Grant or portion thereof for cause - depending on the TRUST AGREEMENT. Of course the Trustee may receive the Grant with or without consideration for Trustee Services.

    Sort of Like The following:

    THIS AGREEMENT, CONVEYANCE and ACCEPTANCE is made and entered onto at the time and on the date appearing in the acknowledgement attached hereto and made a part hereof as though fully set forth herein, by and between, Name of Grantor, Settlor and Creator, who drafted this EXPRESS TRUST as THE GRANTOR, SETTLOR AND CREATOR HEREOF, hereinafter “Creator” or “CREATOR”, and Name of First Trustee, ACCEPTOR and FIRST TRUSTEE hereof in joint tenancy who shall initially compose THE BOARD OF TRUSTEES for conducting said business.

    THE CREATOR hereby constitutes and appoints the above-designated TRUSTEE (S) to be, in fact, TRUSTEE (S) of the TRUST hereby created and established. THE CREATOR for and in consideration of the objects and purposes herein set forth, the sum of Consideration in hand paid and other considerations of value, the receipt of which is hereby acknowledged, hereby agrees to arrange for exchange, conveyance or an assignment to be delivered to said TRUSTEE (S), IN TRUST – said TRUSTEE (S), and his or her successor’s in office, are to hold legal title in joint tenancy and not as tenants in common, to collectively act by virtue of this covenant as BOARD OF TRUSTEES under the name thereunder, dealing in equities, formulae, entities, patents, copyrights, business goodwill, or other Business desired to be engaged in by said TRUSTEE(S).


    This declaration of a TRUST ORGANIZATION
    Authorizes its TRUSTEE (S) to Operate Under
    The Name of


    NAME OF TRUST

    PREAMBLE


    All parties to this Contract are of lawful age to act and are mentally capable to Contract. All parties further acknowledge that they fully understand the obligations this Contract encompasses and imposes upon them and by their signature and seal do hereby accept their respective positions in this Contract creating this Trust.


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    1. First there exists a contract and an exchange of consideration for said contract.
    2. The Trustee pays for the Privilege to UNDERTAKE.
    3. The Grantor Grants the Estate to the Trustee to hold in Trust FBO another.
    4. The Trustee receives the Estate.

    That in equal exchange for the conveyances ascribed in this Agreement, the Trustees shall issue to the Grantor(s) named herein one-hundred (100) Units of Beneficial Interest. These Units are non-transferable. The Trustee(s), on written order of the Grantor, shall transfer the future right to receive distribution of said 100 Units of Beneficial Interest to, and among, the designated Beneficiaries, if any, by cancelling the original written order of the Grantor(s) and issuing new Certificates of Beneficial Interest. The right of distribution of the Beneficial Interest is personal property of the holder and all rights of that personal property are possessed by the holder of the Certificate of Benefficial Interest.


    -----------

    Questions:

    What did the Trustee give to the Grantor for Consideration of the Estate?

    What did the Grantor grant?

    If I issue an original to another, can you now see that I am in office of Grantor and the other is in office of Trust, if accepted, as Trustee? See now a confidence reposed in another? Else why would I issue anything to another?



    -----------------------------------------


    Equity begs a kingdom. An Estate. For the question begging to be answered is: Equity as measured by what? In what?

    shalom,
    mj


    P.S. Those who will not labor to know what the terms they USE mean are as children being tossed to and fro by what they do not know. Hosea 4:6. Notice in the following said TERMS are codified referencing some PRECEDENT. However, any student of Scripture knows that said Precedent is unnecessary as I can know each and every term just by Quoting Scripture verse by verse. However, I have cut/paste from what most people trust in - Precedent - by the way to there great shame - so that my presentment is more easily comprehended.

    So that one may know the TERMS:

    UNDERTAKING, contracts. An engagement by one of the parties to a contract to the other, and not the mutual engagement of the parties to each other; a promise. 5 East, R. 17; 2 Leon. 224, 5; 4 B, & A. 595.

    UNDERTOOK. Assumed; promised.

    USE, estates. A confidence reposed in another, who was made tenant of the land or terre tenant, that he should dispose of the land according to the intention of the cestui que use, or him to whose use it was granted, and suffer [allow] him to take the profits. Plowd. 352; Gilb. on Uses, 1; Bac. Tr. 150, 306; Cornish on Uses, 1 3; 1 Fonb. Eq. 363; 2 Id. 7; Sanders on Uses, 2; Co. Litt. 272, b; 1 Co. 121; 2 Bl. Com. 328; 2 Bouv. Inst. n. 1885, et seq.

    2. In order to create a use, there must always be a good Consideration; though, when once raised, it [the USE] may be passed by grant to a stranger, without consideration. Doct. & Stu. , Dial. ch. 22, 23; Rob. Fr. Conv. 87, n.


    Notice. in USE, it is the CESTUI QUE USE who gives the orders. Notice to create the Use there MUST be Good Consideration. Said Consideration may be the allowance in the Trustee to take [TAKE is an interesting TERM] the profits [personal property = derivative of the estate].

    TAKE. This is a technical expression which signifies to be entitled to; as, a devisee will take under the will. To take also signifies to seize, as to take and carry away.

    Question: Entitled by whom? The answer lies above in Use.

    -------------------------------


    Consider a possibility of Two Trust formations within the NAME of INHERITANCE = Surname. Does not the Male Son in inherit in his Father's Name? Specifically, the wife does not keep her Father's Name but assumes her Husband's name. Therefore the inheritance is in the Father's Name. It is the Father who Granted the Certificate of Live Birth. It was the Father, overshadowing the Son who ALLOWED the Son's fingerprints/footprints and perhaps blood sample, to be placed upon said Certificate.

    To whom was said Certificate made the LIVERY upon? Was it not an OFFICE OF STATE? Is the office of Doctor Alien to the State? What then of the Heir? Where is the Heir? The Estate has been transferred into Trust for the benefit of the Heir! So again, where is the Heir? The State has EVERY right to hear any matter concerning the NAME of INHERITANCE as the State has the Legal Title. But the Heir has the Equitable Title! So again, for the third time, where is the Heir? Is the Heir DEAD? Is this not a valid presumption? Else, where is the Heir?

    Now a Certificate of Beneficial Interest issues from the Trustee back upon the Grantor [Birth Certificate].

    Why would the Heir UNDERTAKE by USING said Certificate of Beneficial Interest as an ID to obtain Driver's License, SSN, etc? See now a man Undertaking for the Grantor [State]? Tell me again, gainsayers: Who issues the Driver's License? Is it not the State, as Grantor? Then, who then is the Trustee?

    In the former scenario, the State as Trustee, with the Legal Title and the man, as Administrator/Beneficiary with the Equitable Title.

    In the latter scenario, the man as Trustee with the Legal Title [SUBJECT to EVERY statute made within the Trust Bylaws] and the Administration/Beneficiary in the State.

    Maybe now you better comprehend why the Attorneys speak of TAXPAYER ENTITLEMENTS.


    -------------------------------

    This is the Technology of Balaam - Numbers 24-26. Israel must VOLUNTARILY bring a curse upon himself.

    If you think me wrong, then show me why in LOGIC.
    Last edited by Michael Joseph; 12-10-11 at 09:10 PM.
    The blessing is in the hand of the doer. Faith absent deeds is dead.

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  4. #84
    Senior Member Treefarmer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Joseph View Post

    Consider a possibility of Two Trust formations within the NAME of INHERITANCE = Surname. Does not the Male Son in inherit in his Father's Name? Specifically, the wife does not keep her Father's Name but assumes her Husband's name. Therefore the inheritance is in the Father's Name. It is the Father who Granted the Certificate of Live Birth. It was the Father, overshadowing the Son who ALLOWED the Son's fingerprints/footprints and perhaps blood sample, to be placed upon said Certificate.

    To whom was said Certificate made the LIVERY upon? Was it not an OFFICE OF STATE? Is the office of Doctor Alien to the State? What then of the Heir? Where is the Heir? The Estate has been transferred into Trust for the benefit of the Heir! So again, where is the Heir? The State has EVERY right to hear any matter concerning the NAME of INHERITANCE as the State has the Legal Title. But the Heir has the Equitable Title! So again, for the third time, where is the Heir? Is the Heir DEAD? Is this not a valid presumption? Else, where is the Heir?

    Now a Certificate of Beneficial Interest issues from the Trustee back upon the Grantor [Birth Certificate].

    Why would the Heir UNDERTAKE by USING said Certificate of Beneficial Interest as an ID to obtain Driver's License, SSN, etc? See now a man Undertaking for the Grantor [State]? Tell me again, gainsayers: Who issues the Driver's License? Is it not the State, as Grantor? Then, who then is the Trustee?

    In the former scenario, the State as Trustee, with the Legal Title and the man, as Administrator/Beneficiary with the Equitable Title.

    In the latter scenario, the man as Trustee with the Legal Title [SUBJECT to EVERY statute made within the Trust Bylaws] and the Administration/Beneficiary in the State.

    Maybe now you better comprehend why the Attorneys speak of TAXPAYER ENTITLEMENTS.


    -------------------------------

    This is the Technology of Balaam - Numbers 24-26. Israel must VOLUNTARILY bring a curse upon himself.

    If you think me wrong, then show me why in LOGIC.
    Which is the former and which is the latter scenario in your post?
    Would you point them out or highlight them please?
    Thank you!
    Treefarmer

    There is power in the blood of Jesus

  5. #85
    Senior Member Michael Joseph's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Treefarmer View Post
    Which is the former and which is the latter scenario in your post?
    Would you point them out or highlight them please?
    Thank you!
    1ST SCENARIO:

    Consider a possibility of Two Trust formations within the NAME of INHERITANCE = Surname. Does not the Male Son in inherit in his Father's Name? Specifically, the wife does not keep her Father's Name but assumes her Husband's name. Therefore the inheritance is in the Father's Name. It is the Father who Granted the Certificate of Live Birth. It was the Father, overshadowing the Son who ALLOWED the Son's fingerprints/footprints and perhaps blood sample, to be placed upon said Certificate.

    To whom was said Certificate made the LIVERY upon? Was it not an OFFICE OF STATE? Is the office of Doctor Alien to the State? What then of the Heir? Where is the Heir? The Estate has been transferred into Trust for the benefit of the Heir! So again, where is the Heir? The State has EVERY right to hear any matter concerning the NAME of INHERITANCE as the State has the Legal Title. But the Heir has the Equitable Title! So again, for the third time, where is the Heir? Is the Heir DEAD? Is this not a valid presumption? Else, where is the Heir?

    Now a Certificate of Beneficial Interest issues from the Trustee back upon the Grantor [Birth Certificate].

    2ND SCENARIO:

    Why would the Heir UNDERTAKE by USING said Certificate of Beneficial Interest as an ID to obtain Driver's License, SSN, etc? See now a man Undertaking for the Grantor [State]? Tell me again, gainsayers: Who issues the Driver's License? Is it not the State, as Grantor? Then, who then is the Trustee?

    In the former scenario, the State as Trustee, with the Legal Title and the man, as Administrator/Beneficiary with the Equitable Title.

    In the latter scenario, the man as Trustee with the Legal Title [SUBJECT to EVERY statute made within the Trust Bylaws] and the Administration/Beneficiary in the State.

    Maybe now you better comprehend why the Attorneys speak of TAXPAYER ENTITLEMENTS.


    -------------------------------

    Treefarmer: If you comprehend in Scenario 1 who is the Grantor? In Scenario 2: Who is the Grantor? Rhetorical Questions of course, but nevertheless in former (1st Scenario) : Man. In latter (2nd Scenario) :State.
    The blessing is in the hand of the doer. Faith absent deeds is dead.

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  6. #86
    Senior Member Treefarmer's Avatar
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    Thank you Michael Joseph, this explanation greatly aided my comprehension.

    The answer to the question in the 2ND SCENARIO, "Why would the Heir UNDERTAKE by USING said Certificate of Beneficial Interest as an ID to obtain Driver's License, SSN, etc?" is easy: because the Heir was told to do so by parents, family members, teachers, elders, etc. The Heir was made to understand that bucking up against this system is equal to being a rebel, a villain, and an outlaw.

    The answer to the question in the 1ST SCENARIO, "Where is the Heir?" is much more elusive. I would like to know the answer, because the UNDERTAKING business has never really worked out well for me.

    Who can explain where the Heir is in the 1ST SCENARIO?
    Treefarmer

    There is power in the blood of Jesus

  7. #87
    Senior Member Michael Joseph's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Treefarmer View Post

    The answer to the question in the 1ST SCENARIO, "Where is the Heir?" is much more elusive. I would like to know the answer, because the UNDERTAKING business has never really worked out well for me.

    Who can explain where the Heir is in the 1ST SCENARIO?
    Look in the mirror maybe you will then comprehend.

    Of course the answers are so obvious as to not need answering. I do not concern myself with the 2nd Scenario. Knowing those things are a waste of my time. I am interested in what I can control. I lack the time or the interest to learn the bylaws and take an oath.

    The Trust already exists. Why would I undertake to become trustee? I highly recommend watching the movie CLEOPATRA version 1963, the entire movie, but see the following starting at minute mark 4:15.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSH0x...eature=related


    The Queen adequately states "I know who you are, WHAT ARE YOU, at the moment?"

    A supplicant is of course one who requests. Therefore a supplicant begs a benefit from a Grantor.
    The blessing is in the hand of the doer. Faith absent deeds is dead.

    Lawful Money Trust Website

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    ONE man or woman can make a difference!

  8. #88
    Alright, let me see if I can shorten this for myself.

    The USE is vested in the Trustee.
    The Trustee is also the Grantee.

    Is the USE vested by legal title? If this is the case, the Trustee possesses the legal title.

    The USE is a special class of conveyance (grant), therefore the conveyance is of special focus?

    Write me a treatise, MJ!!
    I'll settle for a pamphlet though.

  9. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by shikamaru View Post
    If anyone finds a "Gold Clause Resolution of 1933", let me know !!!
    It turns out I WAS WRONG!

    There is a Gold Clause Resolution of 1933!!

    Resolutions are generally, not law unless passed by a president after both houses of congress agree on it. It has a temporary affect on matters. [Black's Law Dictionary, 6th ed., pg. 1310]

    I didn't do my research thoroughly enough.

    For this, I apologize to the board and to motla68 most of all .

    That's why I love you guys. I learn so much. Learn so much more in error.

    Good stuff . Keep it coming and most of all, keep me on my toes.
    Last edited by shikamaru; 12-11-11 at 11:37 AM.

  10. #90
    Humble pie is always a lot less bitter than eating crow!

    Motla68 sent me three PMs that I think were regarding this correction. - Rather than simply post blatant citation for everybody. I am just mentioning that for people to consider the troubled dynamic here.

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