Can God die

[Michael Joseph]

This is a really interesting discussion if MJ will show a little about anatomy too! I have had this talk with him before.

I see men as trees...

David Merrill that discussion is liable to get me hung as a witch. To the 12 year old girl - feed her meat. Yet if she cannot eat meat, then well; in love - go thy way.

I am very hesitant to raise this discourse to that level; as there are many new ones and old ones who may indeed have their faith harmed because they just don't understand. I thought about discussing the First, Second and Third heaven/Earth ages and Election; I have decided not to. If someone would like to have discussion of these privately well that is one thing; but these concepts are so foreign to most they will get in the way of truth.

The blind man could see men as trees - that is as far as I will go here.

Shalom,
mj


new wine in an old wine skin is not good...you have handwritten the Books of Moses....

[Treefarmer]

aw-dawm = mankind
eth-ha-aw-dawm relates to only two - the First Adam [horrible translation] and the Last [Yehoshuah].

Gen 2 - Gen 6 - speak emphatically to only ONE man - that is if you can read the manuscripts. And if you will take the time to read the study that I provided you, you will see that the Man placed in the garden carries both the article and the particle. He is not ordinary mankind [aw-dawm]; created at Gen 1:27. Funny how chinese recorded history goes so much further back in time than yisra'el nation.

Daughters of Eth-ha-aw-dawm - I know you read "man", right? Yet, in manuscripts - eth-ha-aw-dawm (go look for yourself and prove me wrong)

Alef/Tav = Eth - The first two characters of the Man in the Garden - emphatically is Eth - Even a poor man's Stong's Concordance today will bear that out.....

H853
את
'êth

Apparently contracted from H226 in the demonstrative sense of entity; properly self (but generally used to point out more definitely the object of a verb or preposition, even or namely): - (As such unrepresented in English.)

You made my point about the grammar there, but we seem to disagree as to the meaning of it.
I wonder if you are overlooking the fact that the definite article as well as some particles are joined with the noun in Hebrew, unlike in English, French and German, where they occur as separate words.
Hebrew has no indefinite article.

To put it a different way:

Q - What is that?
A - It's 'a'-'man'.

Q - Where is he?
A - 'The'-'man' is in the garden.

Q - What's his name?
A - His name is 'man'.


I looked over your study and I tried to read it, but it didn't make any sense to me.
You seem to see and read things in the Bible that I don't see and read there.
Looks like we can read the same scriptures and come to vastly different conclusions.
That's interesting in itself.

I'm glad we can agree that the flood was to rid the world of genetic hybrids; we just don't agree on how they were created.

Have you noticed how fast leaves can grow out of a rooted twig that's been under water for weeks, or months?
I can see why that dove would have found green leaves after a while of waiting and searching, even though the whole world had been under water, 15 cubits upward and the mountains were covered.

I continue to be interested in your scriptural explorations, because sometimes you come up with some gems.
I really enjoyed the anatomy paper based on Mark 8.
I'm also still wondering what you mean by "ages".
I hope that your ages theory doesn't depend on the serpent seed doctrine, because I think that's totally off the deep end.

Seeing different peoples' scripture interpretations is always interesting to me, because at the very least I figure out different perspectives.
Sometimes I even incorporate those perspectives into my own thinking.

Thank you for the interesting food for thought Michael Joseph, all your efforts are appreciated.
Bright blessings

[Axe]

you have passion for the Word as do I. I am not your judge nor you mine; yet we are brothers as we all belong to the One Creator.

Your beliefs are your and that's great.

Brothers absolutely.

[Frederick Burrell]

Perhaps there is more than one level of interpretation for scripture. I have heard there are at least 7. This could cause some very profound disagreements if we are not acknowledging that fact and are not on the same page or level when conversing about what is being expressed. fb

[Michael Joseph]

MJ

So who or what do you believe the Nephilim to be. fb

Frederick Burrell thank you for this question; I hope you will share your thoughts as well. From the Great Book of Genesis


Gen 6:1 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,


Gen 6:2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.


Gen 6:3 And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

Gen 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.


H5303 - giants
נפל נפיל
nephı̂yl nephil
nef-eel', nef-eel'
From H5307; properly, a feller, that is, a bully or tyrant: - giant.

H1368 - mighty men
גּבּר גּבּור
gibbôr gibbôr
ghib-bore', ghib-bore'
Intensive from the same as H1397; powerful; by implication warrior, tyrant: - champion, chief, X excel, giant, man, mighty (man, one), strong (man), valiant man.


Jud 1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.


2Pe 2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;

Isa 14:10 All they shall speak and say unto thee, Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us?


-----

There are wars in Heaven - the Angelic World as their are wars on Earth. I believe these Angelic Beings were seduced by Ha Satan in first Age [Heaven/Earth] and these thought to do the Work of their Leader. At Isaiah 14 these speak to Ha Satan.

----

Nephilim were superhuman beings that had to be destroyed. Enoch spoke of the prophecy of their destruction see Jude.

Num 13:22 And they ascended by the south, and came unto Hebron; where Ahiman, Sheshai, and Talmai, the children of Anak, were. (Now Hebron was built seven years before Zoan in Egypt.)

Num 13:33 And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

Gen 14:5 And in the fourteenth year came Chedorlaomer, and the kings that were with him, and smote the Rephaims in Ashteroth Karnaim, and the Zuzims in Ham, and the Emims in Shaveh Kiriathaim,


Gen 15:18 In the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:

Gen 15:19 The Kenites, and the Kenizzites, and the Kadmonites,

Gen 15:20 And the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Rephaims,

Gen 15:21 And the Amorites, and the Canaanites, and the Girgashites, and the Jebusites.

The foregoing all contained Angelic DNA.

Deu 2:10 The Emims dwelt therein in times past, a people great, and many, and tall, as the Anakims;

Deu 2:20 (That also was accounted a land of giants: giants dwelt therein in old time; and the Ammonites call them Zamzummims;

Deu 2:21 A people great, and many, and tall, as the Anakims; but the LORD destroyed them before them; and they succeeded them, and dwelt in their stead:

Isa 26:14 They are dead, they shall not live; they are deceased, they shall not rise: therefore hast thou visited and destroyed them, and made all their memory to perish.


H7496
רפא
râphâ'
raw-faw'
From H7495 in the sense of H7503; properly lax, that is, (figuratively) a ghost (as dead; in plural only): - dead, deceased.


Anak was a noted descendant of the Nephilim; and Rapha was another, giving their names respectively to different clans. Anak's father was Arba, the original builder of Hebron (Genesis 35:27. Joshau 15:13; 21:11); and this Palestine branch of the Anakim was not called Abrahim after him, but Anakim after Anak. They were great, mighty, and tall (Deuteronomy 2:10,11,21,22,23; 9:2), evidently inspiring the ten spies with great fear (Numbers 12:33). Og king of Bashan is described in Deuteronomy 3:11).

Their strength is seen in "the giant cities of Bashan" to-day; and we know not how far they may have been utilized by Egypt in the construction of buildings, which is still an unsolved problem.

Arba was rebuilt by the Khabiri or confederates seven years before Zoan was built by Egyptian Pharoahs of the nineteenth dynasty. See note on Numbers 13:22.

Moreover, we have in these mighty men, the "men of renown," the explanation of the origin of the Greek mythology. That mythology was no mere invention of the human brain, but it grew out of the traditions, and memories, and legends of the doings of that mighty race of beings; and was gradually evolved out of the "heroes" of Genesis 6:4. The fact that they were supernatural in their origin formed an easy step to their being regarded as the demi-gods of the Greeks.

---------------------------

[Michael Joseph]

Perhaps there is more than one level of interpretation for scripture. I have heard there are at least 7. This could cause some very profound disagreements if we are not acknowledging that fact and are not on the same page or level when conversing about what is being expressed. fb

thank you for this. Paul himself had three commissions. Most can't get past level one. Yet Paul also wrote to the Kings and Queens and to the Elect and Remnant. The latter two levels I shall not go into here.

By the way Peter was quite aware of Paul's commission and he fully knew the struggle others would have comprehending his writings. Yet those who can see - see.

A blind man by the side of the road yet to receive his sight - said - "I see men as trees walking".

Peter was writing directly to the Elect/Remnant.

[Michael Joseph]

You made my point about the grammar there, but we seem to disagree as to the meaning of it.
I wonder if you are overlooking the fact that the definite article as well as some particles are joined with the noun in Hebrew, unlike in English, French and German, where they occur as separate words.
Hebrew has no indefinite article.

To put it a different way:

Q - What is that?
A - It's 'a'-'man'.

Q - Where is he?
A - 'The'-'man' is in the garden.

Q - What's his name?
A - His name is 'man'.


I looked over your study and I tried to read it, but it didn't make any sense to me.
You seem to see and read things in the Bible that I don't see and read there.
Looks like we can read the same scriptures and come to vastly different conclusions.
That's interesting in itself.

I'm glad we can agree that the flood was to rid the world of genetic hybrids; we just don't agree on how they were created.

Have you noticed how fast leaves can grow out of a rooted twig that's been under water for weeks, or months?
I can see why that dove would have found green leaves after a while of waiting and searching, even though the whole world had been under water, 15 cubits upward and the mountains were covered.

I continue to be interested in your scriptural explorations, because sometimes you come up with some gems.
I really enjoyed the anatomy paper based on Mark 8.
I'm also still wondering what you mean by "ages".
I hope that your ages theory doesn't depend on the serpent seed doctrine, because I think that's totally off the deep end.

Seeing different peoples' scripture interpretations is always interesting to me, because at the very least I figure out different perspectives.
Sometimes I even incorporate those perspectives into my own thinking.

Thank you for the interesting food for thought Michael Joseph, all your efforts are appreciated.
Bright blessings

Thank you Treefarmer. Remember that Noah's flood took one year for the waters to abate. That is to tell this former Environmental and Civil Engineer that every bit of plant life would be absolutely dead.

But look I admit I cannot prove that Noah's flood was not worldwide; it is just my opinion. Yehovah wanted the Gibbor Dead.

Kebra Negast the Ethiopian Bible goes into Great detail regarding these Giants and the children that the women bare to these Angels. I know it's not canonized; neither is nature. Yet, the Promise was given 430 years prior to the Law at Sinai; and Yet; Sodom and Gomorrah were found Guilty of Sin. Selah.

Cain was found guilty of Murder. Where was the Law? Selah.

The Man in the garden was a husbandman [farmer]; the mankind at Gen 1:27 were hunters and fishers. No farmers.

[Frederick Burrell]

MJ

From your quotes it would seem to indicate that either angel took on human form and indwelt physical bodies. Which would not explain the change in DNA. Or they were physical beings from some other place. I tend toward the latter. It could also be possible that there was genetic manipulation involved from physical beings with the ability to accomplish this. This would fall in line with some interpretations of the Sumerian writings.

Your talk of various level of heaven remind me of some writing in regards to IRS cases by a man that was a Morman. Don't recall his name but some where I have a copy of his letter to a fellow that was going to trial in a tax case. He didn't heed the mans warning and ended up serving time. Is what you referring to along the same lines in regards to the various levels of heaven. He espoused Ideas about contracts we enter into before entering this plane. FB

[Michael Joseph]

MJ

From your quotes it would seem to indicate that either angel took on human form and indwell physical bodies. Which would not explain the change in DNA. Or they were physical beings from some other place. I tend toward the latter. It could also be possible that there was genetic manipulation involve from physical beings with the ability to accomplish this. This would fall in line with some interpretations of the Sumerian writings.

Your talk of various level of heaven remind me of some writing in regards to IRS cases by a man that was a Morman. Don't recall his name but some where I have a copy of his letter to a fellow that was going to trial in a tax case. He didn't heed the mans warning and ended up serving time. Is what you referring to along the same lines in regards to the various levels of heaven. He exposed Ideas about contracts we enter into before entering this plane. FB

I have been called a closet Mormon - I have no idea what that is.

Manna was called Angels Food. Yehovah himself rode in a craft to speak to Ezekiel - O' Wheel.

While God is Spirit; I have yet to find that the Angelic World is Spirit. In fact there are signs in the first age of foot prints that look just like mankinds footprints; yet these are 50k years old. Angels came to see Abraham and they sat down and ate dinner with him.

If you know of the Katabole [Greek] or Tuhoo va buhoo [Hebrew] the great overturning at the end of the first Age; then you will comprhehend that we were here before. If too deep maybe I will go into a study of the Ages.

Suffice to say that manna is Angels food - and it sustained mankind. If the Angels came directly here from their former habitation; and they "came into" the daughters of [the Man] - and other daughters as well - the attempt to destroy the bloodline so that the Christ child could not come forth from Chavvah, these would have to be with mass. And in fact they are.

Does that challenge your way of thinking about matters?

Yehovah made a contract with Abraham - saying in him the SEED was called - that was not Plural - there is but one - Yehoshuah. I believe Galations should bring more light to that matter. Regarding Law and the Promise. The Promise being made long before the Law. 430 years to be exact.

We will be judged based on our knowledge. Yet Yehovah wants us to have knowledge of God. Even way before Yehoshuah Yehovah did away with blood animal sacrifice.

See Hosea 6:6; Isaiah 6:4; Isaiah 1.

We are healed in the Promise - therefore we are the Seed of the Promise - or First fruits unto Yehoshuah - made one blood - Under Yehoshuah - Commonwealth of Yisra'el.

The Heaven/Earth Ages have nothing to do with time but to certain events that Yehovah shook both the Heavens and the Earth. In the Age that was there were many who were justified that come thru this age - with destiny and duty. The Elect Son. There were also many who just did not cut it based on one Son - Son of Perdition - who led many astray.

Yehovah decided on a Second Age - Test. "Yet, I shall not make a full end." There are many who cannot see; because it is not for them to see. They can't stand that kind of speech. Yet lets see what the Master said:

"And the disciples came and said to Him, "Why do You speak to them in parables?" Jesus answered them, "To you it has been granted to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been granted. For whoever has, to him more shall be given, and he will have an abundance; but whoever does not have, even what he has shall be taken away from him. Therefore I speak to them in parables; because while seeing they do not see, and while hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand.

[Frederick Burrell]

David Merrill that discussion is liable to get me hung as a witch. To the 12 year old girl - feed her meat. Yet if she cannot eat meat, then well; in love - go thy way.

I am very hesitant to raise this discourse to that level; as there are many new ones and old ones who may indeed have their faith harmed because they just don't understand. I thought about discussing the First, Second and Third heaven/Earth ages and Election; I have decided not to. If someone would like to have discussion of these privately well that is one thing; but these concepts are so foreign to most they will get in the way of truth.

The blind man could see men as trees - that is as far as I will go here.

Shalom,
mj


new wine in an old wine skin is not good...you have handwritten the Books of Moses....

If not now when. I understand your hesitation but, perhaps now is the right time. All things will be revealed. Its happening slowly now but will become a torrent as time passes. Many minds my not be able to cope with the revelations to come. FB