Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 13

Thread: Redemption

  1. #1

    Redemption

    REDEMPTION, contracts. The act of taking back by the seller from the buyer a thing which had been sold subject to the right of repurchase.

    2. The right of redemption then is an agreement by which the seller reserves to himself the power of taking back the thing sold by returning the price paid for it. As to the fund out of which a mortgaged estate is to be redeemed, see Payment. Vide Equity of redemption.

    - Bouvier's Law Dictionary (1856)

    PURCHASE. In its most enlarged and technical sense, purchase signifies the lawful acquisition of real estate by any means whatever, except descent. It is thus defined by Littleton, section 12. "Purchase is called the possession of lands or tenements that a man hath by his own deed or agreement, unto which possession he cometh, not by title of descent from any of his ancestors or cousins, but by his own deed."

    2. It follows, therefore, that not only when a man acquires an estate by buying it for a good or valuable consideration, but also when it is given or devised to him be acquires it by purchase. 2 Bl. Com. 241.

    3. There are six ways of acquiring a title by purchase, namely, 1. By, deed. 2. By devise. 3. By execution. 4. By prescription. 5. By possession, or occupancy. 6. By escheat. In its more limited sense, purchase is applied only to such acquisitions of lands as are obtained by way of bargain and sale for money, or some other valuable consideration. Id. Cruise, Dig. tit. 30, s. 1, to 4; 1 Dall. R. 20. In common parlance, purchase signifies the buying of real estate and of goods and chattels.

    - Bouvier's Law Dictionary (1856)
    Interesting ....

  2. #2
    I propose that the birth certificate is the initiation of billing information (bill of indictment). The charge is going into debt. It is through this certification (registration in commerce) that the new life is appearing dead (CIVIL DEATH). That presumption awaits defeat by the coherent and competent adult (court of record) making a clear demand:


    They shall be redeemed in lawful money on demand...




    P.S. This presumption might be why when a new suitor asks me about keeping credit cards I can never make sense of it. I admonish debit cards if they are accustomed to plastic. I have some old threads around here about using debit cards without billing information. It is a big hassle but unnecessary. If you are not in debt then the billing information cannot be used against you. If you think it can then you need to learn about Refusal for Cause and record forming.
    Last edited by David Merrill; 11-06-12 at 02:21 PM.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by David Merrill View Post
    I propose that the birth certificate is the initiation of billing information (bill of indictment). The charge is going into debt. It is through this certification (registration in commerce) that the new life is appearing dead (CIVIL DEATH). That presumption awaits defeat by the coherent and competent adult (court of record) making a clear demand:


    They shall be redeemed in lawful money on demand...




    P.S. This presumption might be why when a new suitor asks me about keeping credit cards I can never make sense of it. I admonish debit cards if they are accustomed to plastic. I have some old threads around here about using debit cards without billing information. It is a big hassle but unnecessary. If you are not in debt then the billing information cannot be used against you. If you think it can then you need to learn about Refusal for Cause and record forming.
    I contend it creates an ACCOUNT (record).
    An account is a chose in action.
    It inducts a person into a corporate body. Office of citizen ....

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by shikamaru View Post
    I contend it creates an ACCOUNT (record).
    An account is a chose in action.
    It inducts a person into a corporate body. Office of citizen ....
    I think that I can conditionally agree. It is when you as citizen receive a presentment and being a trustee for that ACCOUNT is optional (as it often is) that you can R4C effectively. Citizens can make demand for lawful money redemption and be redeemed from the presumption they are the office of state bank for example.

    The other obvious option is to lose the plastic altogether. I have. I will not risk more than $250 buying the initial debit card - let's say for Christmas time gift purchases on eBay. I really like good deals! But there is the two forty-minute nasty phone calls getting the card activated for use on PayPal and other vendors, without giving them billing information - especially they want a SSN. It gets ugly getting through to an attorney who finally agrees that the surety was on the bills I gave the Safeway cashier. Then if I do not use the card up in less than six months they deactivate it and I have to call, spend a half hour before they will activate it until midnight. Then I make my purchases and try calculating them to use up the card but a few cents...

    The cards cannot be refilled so that is an extra $5 out of pocket. One day the smartass on the phone suggested I just get somebody else to call in the billing information for me. I did not call him dishonest and so he just cancelled the card stealing the remaining balance of about $3.50. Not enough to bother me but it sure makes me wary of how easily I could lose $250 this way!

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by David Merrill View Post
    I think that I can conditionally agree. It is when you as citizen receive a presentment and being a trustee for that ACCOUNT is optional (as it often is) that you can R4C effectively. Citizens can make demand for lawful money redemption and be redeemed from the presumption they are the office of state bank for example.

    The other obvious option is to lose the plastic altogether. I have. I will not risk more than $250 buying the initial debit card - let's say for Christmas time gift purchases on eBay. I really like good deals! But there is the two forty-minute nasty phone calls getting the card activated for use on PayPal and other vendors, without giving them billing information - especially they want a SSN. It gets ugly getting through to an attorney who finally agrees that the surety was on the bills I gave the Safeway cashier. Then if I do not use the card up in less than six months they deactivate it and I have to call, spend a half hour before they will activate it until midnight. Then I make my purchases and try calculating them to use up the card but a few cents...

    The cards cannot be refilled so that is an extra $5 out of pocket. One day the smartass on the phone suggested I just get somebody else to call in the billing information for me. I did not call him dishonest and so he just cancelled the card stealing the remaining balance of about $3.50. Not enough to bother me but it sure makes me wary of how easily I could lose $250 this way!
    It's precisely those kinds of battles I want to avoid. Question: since you bought credits with lawful money, did that change the nature of the credits you bought? I would think not, since those credits are accounting entries. I guess I'm trying to understand what harm there is connected with using the social security number when purchasing accounting credit entries.

    Cheers
    Now you must repent and turn to God so that your sins may be wiped out, that time after time your souls may know the refreshment that comes from the presence of God. Then he will send you Jesus, your long-heralded Christ.

  6. #6
    I do not have a SSN.

    There was no credit involved. The surety was posted on the cash - the signatures of the US Treasurer and the Secretary. They need no more surety because there is no more credit involved than trusting in the United States.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by David Merrill View Post
    I do not have a SSN.

    There was no credit involved. The surety was posted on the cash - the signatures of the US Treasurer and the Secretary. They need no more surety because there is no more credit involved than trusting in the United States.
    I'm sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you had a social security number. My question was more general. For instance, I have a number, but I'm toying with the idea of not using it any longer. I'm exploring all the ramifications of what could happen if I did quit using it.

    But you said no credit was involved. While that's true from your perspective, the bank from which you purchased the debit card created an account for you, and credited your account with the amount. (It seems like trusts are on my mind these days.) Since you deposited lawful money on account with the bank, the bank then became the trustee of the account.

    I see your point about sureties though, and it's a good one. That makes me question what other fiduciary responsibilities the trustee might have. I will dwell on that for a while, and see what percolates. Thanks.

    Cheers
    Now you must repent and turn to God so that your sins may be wiped out, that time after time your souls may know the refreshment that comes from the presence of God. Then he will send you Jesus, your long-heralded Christ.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by David Merrill View Post
    I think that I can conditionally agree. It is when you as citizen receive a presentment and being a trustee for that ACCOUNT is optional (as it often is) that you can R4C effectively. Citizens can make demand for lawful money redemption and be redeemed from the presumption they are the office of state bank for example.
    A citizen functions within a public office exercising public functions.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Michael Joseph's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    peaceful inhabitant on the Earth
    Posts
    1,419
    Quote Originally Posted by shikamaru View Post
    A citizen functions within a public office exercising public functions.
    Q: Can one WITH sin redeem one WITH sin?
    A: No.

    Now consider a Contract who has the right to Redeem? Is it not the Seller? This is a Remainderman right in the Property being Alienated by Purchase. Now consider the following Scripture:

    Deu 32:27 Were it not that I feared the wrath of the enemy, Lest their adversaries should mistake it, And lest they should say,Our hand is high, And Yehovah hath not done all this.
    Deu 32:28 For they are a nation void of deliberation, Neither is there any understanding in them.
    Deu 32:29 O that they were wise, that they understood this, That they would consider their latter end!
    Deu 32:30 How should one chase a thousand, And two put ten thousand to flight, Except their Rock had sold them, And the Yehovah had shut them up?

    "shut them up" = fenced in

    Now therefore we see in v.30 that Yehovah SOLD his People and therefore we see that ONLY Yehovah has the right of Redemption in regard to His People. Yehovah Saves [Redeems] in Yehoshuah.

    Psa 130:1 Out of the distress have I cried unto Thee, O LORD.
    Psa 130:2 Lord, hear my voice: Let Thine ears be attentive To the voice of my supplications.
    Psa 130:3 If Thou, LORD, shouldest mark iniquities, O Lord, who shall stand?
    Psa 130:4 Because there is the forgiveness with Thee, That Thou mayest be feared.
    Psa 130:5 I wait for the LORD, my soul doth wait, And in His word do I hope.
    Psa 130:6 My soul waiteth for the Lord More than watchers for the morning while watching for the morning.
    Psa 130:7 Let Israel hope in the LORD: For with the LORD there is grace, And with Him is plenteous redemption.
    Psa 130:8 And He shall redeem Israel From all his iniquities.


    Sin or Debt is being imputed unto Man and recorded according to v.3. Therefore how can man redeem himself as man is with a debt that cannot be paid. Therefore the redemption for this debt Has to be paid in order for righteousness to be fulfilled. The books must be balanced. Therefore according to the Law established by The Righteous One - settled in the Heavens - and granted to man by a mediator in Moses, the Redemption must be according to that Law.


    Psa 11:1 In the LORD I have fled for refuge: How say ye to me, "Flee like a bird to your mountain?"
    Psa 11:2 For, lo, the lawless ones bend their bow, They make ready their arrow upon the string, That they may in the darkness shoot at the upright ones in heart.
    Psa 11:3 If the settled order of truth be destroyed, What can a righteous do ?
    Psa 11:4 The LORD is in His holy temple, the LORD's throne is in heaven: His eyes behold, His eyelids try, the sons of Adam.
    Psa 11:5 The LORD trieth a righteous one: But the lawless one and him that loveth violence He hateth.
    Psa 11:6 Upon the lawless one He shall rain snares, Fire and brimstone, and an horrible blasts: this shall be the portion of their cup.
    Psa 11:7 For the righteous LORD loveth righteousness; An upright one shall gaze upon His face.


    Now the Law of God is the Character of God in terms of The Way of God. And therefore if God has sold His People to the Lawless, then the means for Redemption must be in accord with the Law of God in Sacrifice. And therefore the only One who can Redeem God's People is God. And the redemption price is NOT money as that would not be in accord with God's Law.

    Isa 52:3 For thus saith the LORD, Ye have sold yourselves for nought; and ye shall be redeemed not with silver.
    Isa 52:4 For thus saith the Lord GOD, My people went down aforetime into Egypt to sojourn there; and the Assyrian oppressed them for nothing.
    Isa 52:5 Now therefore, what do I here, saith the LORD, that My People hath been taken away for nought? they that rule over them make them to howl, saith the LORD; and My name continually every day is blasphemed.
    Isa 52:6 Therefore My People shall know My name: therefore they shall know in that day that I am He That doth speak: behold, it is I.

    Again, I ask, can one WITH sin redeem one WITH sin? Answer: No.

    God is Everywhere absent limitation except the self imposed Laws in Truth and Righteousness that were settled as the Code or Way. These laws shall be obeyed in sincerity and truth in righteousness to the Creator or in Sin and Debt the Laws are disobeyed. If in Sin there is either to be in sin by way of ignorance or in rebellion. Either way, there is either Sin or Transgression - which is to say one is STEALING from the Kingdom of God. Thou shall NOT steal. Therefore we see the "thieves" on the cross [in sedition]. There debt in sedition was paid in death.

    But we see in Yehoshuah LIFE as the debt, which requires death, is paid. So we see that only one without Sin can redeem those With sin.

    Now, therefore, if one remains in Sin WILLINGLY which is to say in Sedition and Transgression which is to say outright Rebellion, then that one cannot profit from the Redemption in Yehoshuah. For this one places Yehoshuah on the Cross again and again and again, WILLINGLY and therefore there is no longer any Grace for this one in Redemption.


    Gal 5:1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

    Heb 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
    Heb 2:15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

    Now then, Satan used to have one "big stick" in terms of debt in sin. If only for one sin there was no Estate in Salvation; and, as such, man was in a wretched condition in Fear. But Yehoshuah conquered Death in Redemption for only He could Redeem those Under the Debt of Sin [Lawlessness] as He was both Creator and Redeemer and Settlor.

    Yehoshuah means Yehovah Saves.

    Gen 2:7 And Yehvoah Elohim formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

    =================

    If I make a use of property that does not belong to me to gain a purchase, then consider now, do I have a right of Redemption? Well sort of. But my right of redemption is limited to the laws governing the property that I made a use of to gain said purchase.

    Now consider one that owes a debt to another. The Debtor is subject to the Lender. If the Lender REQUIRES payment in a certain form, then what of the Debtors laws? Do those laws really matter? Consider the foregoing in light of metals and notes.

    Don't you find it interesting that Birth Certificates appreared around the time that gold was required to be abandoned by the citizenry. I have a friend whose grandfather tendered his coins in good faith, only to be told later than if the gold had numismatic value it need not be abandoned or surrendered. His grandfather was upset when he tried to get his gold back only to find the bank manager could do nothing for him.

    We need to learn to read the small print. We need to take full liability for ourselves. One in limited liability cannot redeem himself. For how can one Redeem making a use of property that is not his own?

    Does a man's labor belong to him? I say yes. Can a man exchange his labor in contract? I say yes? Can a man WILLINGLY and VOLUNTARILY exchange his labor in contract for nothing? I say yes. Is this slavery? I say no. The man freely gave [granted] his labor in Trust for Society [a Public Trust] for the benefit of all placing his Trust in the "workings" of that Society.

    But what sayeth God?

    Rev 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come forth out of her, My People, in order that ye be not partakers of her sins, and in order that ye receive not of her plagues.

    =================

    It is all about Trust. Only you can decide where you will place your trust. If in God, then Obey God. If in man, then obey man.

    Jer 17:5 Thus saith the LORD; "Cursed be the strong man that confideth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the LORD.

    Jer 17:7 Blessed is the strong man that confideth in the LORD, and whose confidence the LORD is.


    continued...
    Last edited by Michael Joseph; 09-21-13 at 06:31 PM.
    The blessing is in the hand of the doer. Faith absent deeds is dead.

    https://www.lawfulmoneytrust.com

    ONE man or woman can make a difference!

  10. #10
    Senior Member Michael Joseph's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    peaceful inhabitant on the Earth
    Posts
    1,419
    continued from previous post...



    Is not God able to provide for a man? Did not God create all man? Is not the Kingdom OF God and therefore all that is belongs to God? What then of man? There ONLY lies a Choice whom man shall serve.

    Deu_30:19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:


    Now then, we are Redeemed by the Sacrifice of the Body [Flesh and Blood] of Jesus IF and only IF, we place our Trust in Yehoshuah, which is to say we Obey not in legal duty but in love - we sincerely repent of lawlessness in sin and rebellion. Therefore Yehoshuah is my Redeemer, my Savior in whom I trust.


    For I cannot redeem myself from sin whilst I am in sin. And therefore as I stand before the throne with Satan [as the D.A.] - I am naked and guilty. I am absent hope as I have a debt that I cannot pay. My only hope is to place my trust in my Advocate [Lawyer] - Yehoshuah who has the ability to redeem my debt before the Throne of Righteousness. So I admit in my guilt and I plead in Christ.

    But I ask the reader, how can I plead in Christ if I have not submitted myself to Christ in Obedience? I would be a pretender. For how can I both stand on my own and in Christ simultaneously? Either I am without debt [absent sin] and able to stand before the Throne, or I am with sin and unable to stand. If the latter, then I require that my debt be redeemed if I am to have my debt settled [zeroed]. Else I remain in slavery to that debt bondage. Which is to say ALL SIN LEADS TO DEATH. Which is to say in sin, Satan is my master. For who has power of death? A: Satan.

    Heb 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
    Heb 2:15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

    So we see that Yehoshuah in obedience to God [He was absent Sin] overcame Death [which is Debt - for all sin leads to Death]. But the REWARD in only in the hand of the Righteous who place their Trust in Yehoshuah. Else, there only remains Mercy. For those absent Trust in Yehoshuah lack standing before the Throne. Actually we all lack standing before the Throne but those in Yehoshuah do not have their Debt accounted as there is Redemption of their Debt.

    Therefore man is indeed naked. As was Adam/Eve's report - they declared they were naked. They lacked a covering in clothes and in law. As they FREELY and WILLINGLY submitted to Satan in obedience [they ate] and in disobedience they cut themselves apart from God.

    Shalom,
    MJ
    The blessing is in the hand of the doer. Faith absent deeds is dead.

    https://www.lawfulmoneytrust.com

    ONE man or woman can make a difference!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •