Q: Can one WITH sin redeem one WITH sin?Originally Posted by shikamaru
A: No.
Now consider a Contract who has the right to Redeem? Is it not the Seller? This is a Remainderman right in the Property being Alienated by Purchase. Now consider the following Scripture:
Deu 32:27 Were it not that I feared the wrath of the enemy, Lest their adversaries should mistake it, And lest they should say,Our hand is high, And Yehovah hath not done all this.
Deu 32:28 For they are a nation void of deliberation, Neither is there any understanding in them.
Deu 32:29 O that they were wise, that they understood this, That they would consider their latter end!
Deu 32:30 How should one chase a thousand, And two put ten thousand to flight, Except their Rock had sold them, And the Yehovah had shut them up?
"shut them up" = fenced in
Now therefore we see in v.30 that Yehovah SOLD his People and therefore we see that ONLY Yehovah has the right of Redemption in regard to His People. Yehovah Saves [Redeems] in Yehoshuah.
Psa 130:1 Out of the distress have I cried unto Thee, O LORD.
Psa 130:2 Lord, hear my voice: Let Thine ears be attentive To the voice of my supplications.
Psa 130:3 If Thou, LORD, shouldest mark iniquities, O Lord, who shall stand?
Psa 130:4 Because there is the forgiveness with Thee, That Thou mayest be feared.
Psa 130:5 I wait for the LORD, my soul doth wait, And in His word do I hope.
Psa 130:6 My soul waiteth for the Lord More than watchers for the morning while watching for the morning.
Psa 130:7 Let Israel hope in the LORD: For with the LORD there is grace, And with Him is plenteous redemption.
Psa 130:8 And He shall redeem Israel From all his iniquities.
Sin or Debt is being imputed unto Man and recorded according to v.3. Therefore how can man redeem himself as man is with a debt that cannot be paid. Therefore the redemption for this debt Has to be paid in order for righteousness to be fulfilled. The books must be balanced. Therefore according to the Law established by The Righteous One - settled in the Heavens - and granted to man by a mediator in Moses, the Redemption must be according to that Law.
Psa 11:1 In the LORD I have fled for refuge: How say ye to me, "Flee like a bird to your mountain?"
Psa 11:2 For, lo, the lawless ones bend their bow, They make ready their arrow upon the string, That they may in the darkness shoot at the upright ones in heart.
Psa 11:3 If the settled order of truth be destroyed, What can a righteous do ?
Psa 11:4 The LORD is in His holy temple, the LORD's throne is in heaven: His eyes behold, His eyelids try, the sons of Adam.
Psa 11:5 The LORD trieth a righteous one: But the lawless one and him that loveth violence He hateth.
Psa 11:6 Upon the lawless one He shall rain snares, Fire and brimstone, and an horrible blasts: this shall be the portion of their cup.
Psa 11:7 For the righteous LORD loveth righteousness; An upright one shall gaze upon His face.
Now the Law of God is the Character of God in terms of The Way of God. And therefore if God has sold His People to the Lawless, then the means for Redemption must be in accord with the Law of God in Sacrifice. And therefore the only One who can Redeem God's People is God. And the redemption price is NOT money as that would not be in accord with God's Law.
Isa 52:3 For thus saith the LORD, Ye have sold yourselves for nought; and ye shall be redeemed not with silver.
Isa 52:4 For thus saith the Lord GOD, My people went down aforetime into Egypt to sojourn there; and the Assyrian oppressed them for nothing.
Isa 52:5 Now therefore, what do I here, saith the LORD, that My People hath been taken away for nought? they that rule over them make them to howl, saith the LORD; and My name continually every day is blasphemed.
Isa 52:6 Therefore My People shall know My name: therefore they shall know in that day that I am He That doth speak: behold, it is I.
Again, I ask, can one WITH sin redeem one WITH sin? Answer: No.
God is Everywhere absent limitation except the self imposed Laws in Truth and Righteousness that were settled as the Code or Way. These laws shall be obeyed in sincerity and truth in righteousness to the Creator or in Sin and Debt the Laws are disobeyed. If in Sin there is either to be in sin by way of ignorance or in rebellion. Either way, there is either Sin or Transgression - which is to say one is STEALING from the Kingdom of God. Thou shall NOT steal. Therefore we see the "thieves" on the cross [in sedition]. There debt in sedition was paid in death.
But we see in Yehoshuah LIFE as the debt, which requires death, is paid. So we see that only one without Sin can redeem those With sin.
Now, therefore, if one remains in Sin WILLINGLY which is to say in Sedition and Transgression which is to say outright Rebellion, then that one cannot profit from the Redemption in Yehoshuah. For this one places Yehoshuah on the Cross again and again and again, WILLINGLY and therefore there is no longer any Grace for this one in Redemption.
Gal 5:1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
Heb 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
Heb 2:15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
Now then, Satan used to have one "big stick" in terms of debt in sin. If only for one sin there was no Estate in Salvation; and, as such, man was in a wretched condition in Fear. But Yehoshuah conquered Death in Redemption for only He could Redeem those Under the Debt of Sin [Lawlessness] as He was both Creator and Redeemer and Settlor.
Yehoshuah means Yehovah Saves.
Gen 2:7 And Yehvoah Elohim formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
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If I make a use of property that does not belong to me to gain a purchase, then consider now, do I have a right of Redemption? Well sort of. But my right of redemption is limited to the laws governing the property that I made a use of to gain said purchase.
Now consider one that owes a debt to another. The Debtor is subject to the Lender. If the Lender REQUIRES payment in a certain form, then what of the Debtors laws? Do those laws really matter? Consider the foregoing in light of metals and notes.
Don't you find it interesting that Birth Certificates appreared around the time that gold was required to be abandoned by the citizenry. I have a friend whose grandfather tendered his coins in good faith, only to be told later than if the gold had numismatic value it need not be abandoned or surrendered. His grandfather was upset when he tried to get his gold back only to find the bank manager could do nothing for him.
We need to learn to read the small print. We need to take full liability for ourselves. One in limited liability cannot redeem himself. For how can one Redeem making a use of property that is not his own?
Does a man's labor belong to him? I say yes. Can a man exchange his labor in contract? I say yes? Can a man WILLINGLY and VOLUNTARILY exchange his labor in contract for nothing? I say yes. Is this slavery? I say no. The man freely gave [granted] his labor in Trust for Society [a Public Trust] for the benefit of all placing his Trust in the "workings" of that Society.
But what sayeth God?
Rev 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come forth out of her, My People, in order that ye be not partakers of her sins, and in order that ye receive not of her plagues.
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It is all about Trust. Only you can decide where you will place your trust. If in God, then Obey God. If in man, then obey man.
Jer 17:5 Thus saith the LORD; "Cursed be the strong man that confideth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the LORD.
Jer 17:7 Blessed is the strong man that confideth in the LORD, and whose confidence the LORD is.
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