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Thread: Law of Trusts

  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by motla68 View Post
    Rights are benefits, ....
    This is an interesting proposition. The term "right" has a multitude of definitions and meanings depending on context.

    Quote Originally Posted by motla68
    if equity follows the law then liability will follow from what rights you are claiming. Just be careful where you claim your rights come from.
    Equity comes to us from the Law or Remedies. It is/was a remedial branch of law.

    Equity concerns itself with imperfect rights.

    Perfect rights are outside the realm of equity. The holder of a perfect has both the benefit and the burden. No other parties are involved.
    There is no obligation to enforce when one person is holder of both the right with its corresponding duty.
    Last edited by shikamaru; 07-20-11 at 05:28 PM.

  2. #122
    Senior Member motla68's Avatar
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    Sorry, I cannot find exact definition for this procedural status, can you extrapolate? My conscience tells me if you have perfect right then you do not have a duty, you have a right of choice to perform or not perform without that attachment. If I am mistaken here where does the authority to enforce a duty come from?

  3. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by motla68 View Post
    Sorry, I cannot find exact definition for this procedural status, can you extrapolate? My conscience tells me if you have perfect right then you do not have a duty, you have a right of choice to perform or not perform without that attachment. If I am mistaken here where does the authority to enforce a duty come from?
    The duty is always there, however it is vested in the individual who has the benefit, not someone else.

    Example:

    Assume I have a computer. That computer is absolutely mine. I have the benefit of the usage of the computer as well as its burdens i.e. administration, installation, and maintenance of the machine.

    The authority to enforce a duty comes from the power of the government.

    Equity considers done what ought to be done (maxim).

  4. #124
    Senior Member motla68's Avatar
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    How is it the government has authority to enforce a duty upon you if it is absolutely yours? If this is sought then it is not a perfect right according to your own words.

    Now your going back to equity which you said was imperfect rights.

    Quoted: " Equity concerns itself with imperfect rights. "

    Which is it?

    I am not trying to be an ass or be sarcastic here, but better me to be asking these questions rather then a opposing district attorney or anyone else who has a claim to what your holding. If you have absoluteness then you should be able to take that computer out to the dessert with a shotgun and tear it up.

  5. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by motla68 View Post
    How is it the government has authority to enforce a duty upon you if it is absolutely yours?
    They can't.

    Quote Originally Posted by motla68
    If this is sought then it is not a perfect right according to your own words.
    That is correct. If one is seeking remedy from a court, they are seeking to impose a duty on another person i.e an obligation. This obligation is composed of both the right and its correlative duty.

    Quote Originally Posted by motla68
    Now your going back to equity which you said was imperfect rights.

    Quoted: " Equity concerns itself with imperfect rights. "

    Which is it?
    Equity concerns itself with imperfect and relative rights.

    A Brief Survey of Equity Jurisdiction by C. C. Langdell.
    http://www.constitution.org/cmt/ccl/equi_juris.htm

    The book above is one the absolute best I have read in explaining the nature of equity jurisdiction.
    Trusts are squarely an object within the realm of equity jurisdiction.

    In addition to the above, you should learn the history and politics surrounding equity and equity courts.

    Equity trumps law is relatively recent custom given some ruling by Francis Bacon, an enemy of Edward Coke (pronounced Cook) who just happened to be a common law jurist . James I is going to go along with Bacon for he is not pleased with Coke either .

    We may need to back track through our conversation in order to clear up this confusion.
    Last edited by shikamaru; 07-21-11 at 01:33 PM.

  6. #126
    Here is a thread I started on the High Court of Chancery (Equity)

    http://savingtosuitorsclub.net/showt...rt-of-Chancery

  7. #127
    Senior Member motla68's Avatar
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    Yes, there is confusion here. I thought we closed the door on equity since it was imperfect rights. I simply asked you to explain a "perfect right", which then you threw the word duty into the explanation, I then asked you where the authority for this duty was coming from and that is when you brought the equity language back into it.

    Now lets just stick with the original question to explain a "perfect right" and to just let you know if you throw the word " duty" in again I am going to call you out on it.
    In my mind anyway "perfect" has no other outside liens or duties attached to it.

    Please continue?

  8. #128
    Quote Originally Posted by motla68 View Post
    Yes, there is confusion here. I thought we closed the door on equity since it was imperfect rights. I simply asked you to explain a "perfect right", which then you threw the word duty into the explanation, I then asked you where the authority for this duty was coming from and that is when you brought the equity language back into it.
    A perfect right is where a person has both the right and duty vested in them.
    The authority for this duty is the laws of nature and God.

    Quote Originally Posted by motla68
    Now lets just stick with the original question to explain a "perfect right" and to just let you know if you throw the word " duty" in again I am going to call you out on it.
    In my mind anyway "perfect" has no other outside liens or duties attached to it.

    Please continue?
    Duty is not limited to outside liens or duties.
    If you are out in the jungle, you have a duty of care not to be stupid and violate the laws of nature or fail to heed warning signs.

    Just because this duty is not being enforced by some man-made authority doesn't mean said duty is absent.

    The penalty for violating duties under the laws of nature tend to be much more severe for their transgression.

  9. #129
    Closed the door on equity?



    I doubt the notion has much practical application.

    Your response though, it reminds me of a fellow who showed the jury, during voir dire a photo of a bloody aborted fetus - in a traffic prosecution! He then cited Roe v. Wade and basically built the record convicting the State of murder...

    The trial fell apart but not before the judge lectured about the advantages of statutory as opposed to common law. - As the jury might well have hung the defendant over a traffic violation under the crudeness of pure common law.



    Regards,

    David Merrill.



  10. #130
    Senior Member motla68's Avatar
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    Shikamaru,

    Yes, this is the distinction I was trying to make clear, where duty is vested.
    Earlier in this thread you quoted:
    " The authority to enforce a duty comes from the power of the government."

    In this last thread you made a dual argument which opposes one another.
    The first part is correct where you quoted:
    " A perfect right is where a person has both the right and duty vested in them. "
    This part proves the distinction I was making of perfection has no outside vestment.
    Here is where the double minded confusion comes in, you then quoted:
    " The authority for this duty is the laws of nature and God. "

    What we claim has attachments to us, are you saying your God and that your perfect?
    I would hope your not this conceited.

    My conscience is that we are not perfect, we make mistakes often so thus we can never claim perfection, only creator of the universe can make that claim.
    Land is equity, we came from the dust, it is our imperfections which make each one of us unique. So now what is your law? that would be natural law correct?
    IF your law is natural law when you use a law created by another entity it then comes to you as a benefit accepted as value. We our are own worst enemy,
    think about it before replying again.
    .................................................. .........................

    David,

    Your way off base here, we are not talking civil statutory construction. This is about common law in the private I am speaking of. When someone cannot settle a matter privately then that is when they bring it to a public court as mediator, I know you do not believe in private law so this might not be a conversation for you to get into the middle of.

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