endorsing and SS.......a big question!

[motla68]

The debate over wages and taxes has been argued for way too long, so as such is lawful money versus fiat currency. It all falls under other property to which is the after thought of man, not the creator. It's time to stop beating ones head against the wall expecting different results, how about changing direction once in for all, this could go on for days.
We cannot all save the world, maybe Jesse just does not want to open up to other possibilities and is just happy with whatever he is doing currently ? Cannot change someones mind unless they want to change. (free will and right to self determination).

Here is another issue worth debating, are you a label or are you part of the land (natural resource). Check out this fascinating blog post a friend of mine wrote:
http://onlashuk.wordpress.com/2011/0...l-entry-point/
Another group discussion on this has been started here as well:
http://groups.google.com/group/born-...7065930ec2d9bf

- Part of the Peaceful Inhabitant vs. Enemy Combatant series of thought, you know from the JAG manual for armies in the field, how do you want to be marked and identified from the military occupation? Yes, they do use a procedure called identity markers in their computer systems to which are linked together and talk to eachother and that also includes I*R*S*.

[jesse james]

The debate over wages and taxes has been argued for way too long, so as such is lawful money versus fiat currency. It all falls under other property to which is the after thought of man, not the creator. It's time to stop beating ones head against the wall expecting different results, how about changing direction once in for all, this could go on for days.
We cannot all save the world, maybe Jesse just does not want to open up to other possibilities and is just happy with whatever he is doing currently ? Cannot change someones mind unless they want to change. (free will and right to self determination).

Here is another issue worth debating, are you a label or are you part of the land (natural resource). Check out this fascinating blog post a friend of mine wrote:
http://onlashuk.wordpress.com/2011/0...l-entry-point/
Another group discussion on this has been started here as well:
http://groups.google.com/group/born-...7065930ec2d9bf

- Part of the Peaceful Inhabitant vs. Enemy Combatant series of thought, you know from the JAG manual for armies in the field, how do you want to be marked and identified from the military occupation? Yes, they do use a procedure called identity markers in their computer systems to which are linked together and talk to eachother and that also includes I*R*S*.

No Motla68, "wages" and taxes hasnt been argued properly!
Why do you want to derail and change the subject of my thread?
You sound like controlled opposition......steer away from the truth kinda thing.

[motla68]

No Motla68, "wages" and taxes hasnt been argued properly!
Why do you want to derail and change the subject of my thread?
You sound like controlled opposition......steer away from the truth kinda thing.

No, more like come into the enlightenment away from all that distracts one from the truth.
If you really even had put in any effort to digest what I have said you would see how
pointless this thread really is. Dog chasing tail.

[jesse james]

No, more like come into the enlightenment away from all that distracts one from the truth.
If you really even had put in any effort to digest what I have said you would see how
pointless this thread really is. Dog chasing tail.

Thats because what you said doesnt address the imposition correctly

[motla68]

Thats because what you said doesnt address the imposition correctly

ok, lets address imposition. Such authority comes from a law or duty so what would that be ?

Before you try to play the card of receiving a SSN, let me throw this out to you:

5 USC 552A(a)
(13) the term “Federal personnel” means officers and employees of the Government of the United States, members of the uniformed services (including members of the Reserve Components), individuals entitled to receive immediate or deferred retirement benefits under any retirement program of the Government of the United States (including survivor benefits).

I am not a federal employee so now what? You will have to show me where I am some sort of statutory employee to perform a duty.

[jesse james]

ok, lets address imposition. Such authority comes from a law or duty so what would that be ?

Before you try to play the card of receiving a SSN, let me throw this out to you:

5 USC 552A(a)
(13) the term “Federal personnel” means officers and employees of the Government of the United States, members of the uniformed services (including members of the Reserve Components), individuals entitled to receive immediate or deferred retirement benefits under any retirement program of the Government of the United States (including survivor benefits).

I am not a federal employee so now what? You will have to show me where I am some sort of statutory employee to perform a duty.

Wow Motla68!
I'm simply amazed you cannot connect the dots. You sincerely need to be impartial to allow to see all the facts...........you really have to be honest with yourself. It was the hardest thing I did after being banned from losthorizons, but I wanted to know the truth!
I didnt like it but it was the truth.
Social Security is a retirement program of the Government of the United States. Social Security was enacted by Roosevelt. He acting as president of the US set up a panel that later became the SSA. Still today the SSA is a federal agency and therefor administering a government retirement.
If you ever look at a SS5 form (ssn application form) it is signed under penalty of perjury of being a "US citizen".
The courts know what "US citizens" are:

“...he was not a citizen of the United States, he was a citizen and voter of the State,...” “One may be a citizen of a State an yet not a citizen of the United States”.
McDonel v. The State, 90 Ind. 320 (1883)

“That there is a citizenship of the United States and citizenship of a state,...”
Tashiro v. Jordan, 201 Cal. 236 (1927)

"A citizen of the United States is a citizen of the federal government ..."
Kitchens v. Steele, 112 F.Supp 383


In title 5, the same section you got this "federal personel" from, they define who a "individual" is:
§ 552a. Records maintained on individuals
(2) the term “individual” means a citizen of the United States or an alien lawfully admitted for permanent residence;

"Federal personel" of 5USC 552(A) and a 14th amemdment "US citizen" are both one in the same Motla68! You dont have to be of colored race to apply for a ssn.
You've read my post and know I bring up 26usc 3101 and 3402 alot. Well did you happen to notice 3101?

§ 3101. Rate of tax
(a) Old-age, survivors, and disability insurance
In addition to other taxes, there is hereby imposed on the income of every individual a tax equal to the following percentages of the wages (as defined in section 3121 (a)) received by him with respect to employment (as defined in section 3121 (b))—

See anything, motla68, simular in title 5 "federal personel"?

5 USC 552A(a)
(13) the term “Federal personnel” means officers and employees of the Government of the United States, members of the uniformed services (including members of the Reserve Components), individuals entitled to receive immediate or deferred retirement benefits under any retirement program of the Government of the United States (including survivor benefits).

Your duty as a "US citizen" is to be regulated and pay any taxes to receive the associated "privileges".
Also, when you see someone do a FOIA to get their records like you see alot of people in the patriot movement do they dont realize the records they wish to get come from Title 5............ § 552a. Records maintained on individuals
You are only in the government record system because the SSA inputs the information.
Thank you for bringing title 5 to this thread.
Title 5 is where "employment" as defined for the Social Security Act originates from................if you didnt know.

Now if theres any doubt click this link which is from the SSA website linking to Title 5 itself. You even see 5USC 552A http://www.ssa.gov/OP_Home/comp2/D-USC-05.html

[motla68]

Wow Motla68!
I'm simply amazed you cannot connect the dots. You sincerely need to be impartial to allow to see all the facts...........you really have to be honest with yourself. It was the hardest thing I did after being banned from losthorizons, but I wanted to know the truth!
I didnt like it but it was the truth.
Social Security is a retirement program of the Government of the United States. Social Security was enacted by Roosevelt. He acting as president of the US set up a panel that later became the SSA. Still today the SSA is a federal agency and therefor administering a government retirement.
If you ever look at a SS5 form (ssn application form) it is signed under penalty of perjury of being a "US citizen".
The courts know what "US citizens" are:

“...he was not a citizen of the United States, he was a citizen and voter of the State,...” “One may be a citizen of a State an yet not a citizen of the United States”.
McDonel v. The State, 90 Ind. 320 (1883)

“That there is a citizenship of the United States and citizenship of a state,...”
Tashiro v. Jordan, 201 Cal. 236 (1927)

"A citizen of the United States is a citizen of the federal government ..."
Kitchens v. Steele, 112 F.Supp 383


In title 5, the same section you got this "federal personel" from, they define who a "individual" is:
§ 552a. Records maintained on individuals
(2) the term “individual” means a citizen of the United States or an alien lawfully admitted for permanent residence;

"Federal personel" of 5USC 552(A) and a 14th amemdment "US citizen" are both one in the same Motla68! You dont have to be of colored race to apply for a ssn.
You've read my post and know I bring up 26usc 3101 and 3402 alot. Well did you happen to notice 3101?

§ 3101. Rate of tax
(a) Old-age, survivors, and disability insurance
In addition to other taxes, there is hereby imposed on the income of every individual a tax equal to the following percentages of the wages (as defined in section 3121 (a)) received by him with respect to employment (as defined in section 3121 (b))—

See anything, motla68, simular in title 5 "federal personel"?

5 USC 552A(a)
(13) the term “Federal personnel” means officers and employees of the Government of the United States, members of the uniformed services (including members of the Reserve Components), individuals entitled to receive immediate or deferred retirement benefits under any retirement program of the Government of the United States (including survivor benefits).

Your duty as a "US citizen" is to be regulated and pay any taxes to receive the associated "privileges".
Also, when you see someone do a FOIA to get their records like you see alot of people in the patriot movement do they dont realize the records they wish to get come from Title 5............ § 552a. Records maintained on individuals
You are only in the government record system because the SSA inputs the information.
Thank you for bringing title 5 to this thread.
Title 5 is where "employment" as defined for the Social Security Act originates from................if you didnt know.

Now if theres any doubt click this link which is from the SSA website linking to Title 5 itself. You even see 5USC 552A http://www.ssa.gov/OP_Home/comp2/D-USC-05.html

The word "person" in legal terminology normally includes in its scope a variety of entities other than man. See e.g. 1 U.S.C. sec 1. ; Church of Scientology v. U.S. Dept. of Justice (1979) 612 F.2d 417, 425.

U.S. Code:
TITLE 1 > CHAPTER 1 > § 1
§ 1. Words denoting number, gender, and so forth
" the words “person” and “whoever” include corporations, companies, associations, firms, partnerships, societies, and joint stock companies, as well as individuals"

True name never signed a SS5. True name never signed a oath of loyalty to be a citizen, Next?

[stoneFree]

It was the hardest thing I did after being banned from losthorizons, but I wanted to know the truth!

HA! That's bovine excrement & we all know it. You have no interest in the truth, if so you'd have taken a look at lawful money. You're a one-man chuckle factory Jesse.

But let's consider your premise. The SSA records on "JohnnyCash" show he spent several years participating in the SS scam, paying in over $34,000. And then in 2008 the Earnings Record shows he fell off the slave wagon. His SS earnings went to zero. Apparently he still earns income, having deposited over $115k lawful money into Peoples United three days ago, so we can't say he's poor. If he is still a US Citizen, does he owe SS taxes on that deposit or not? If so, how has Johnny been able to avoid the BIG BAD IRS and all it's penalties that you continue to scare us with?

And hey, how's that MFing Global takedown working out for your boss?

[stoneFree]

That's it? That's the proof you don't pay taxes nor participate in SS, Jesse? You're comical. The SSA sent me a SS number when I was a teenager, but once I learned I could opt-out of paying into SS by redeeming lawful money, I did. And it worked. I haven't owed, nor paid, employment taxes nor income taxes in years. You appear to be suggesting the statutory route into "wages" is solely responsible for SS tax. Do you think the banksters running this scam have laid out the true nature of their currency scam for all to see?

The question in my mind is... what will you do when it hits the fan Jesse? You can't hide your role in support of this decades old scam. Do you plan to hide from the truth commission? In what corner of the globe?

[jesse james]

That's it? That's the proof you don't pay taxes nor participate in SS, Jesse? You're comical. The SSA sent me a SS number when I was a teenager, but once I learned I could opt-out of paying into SS by redeeming lawful money, I did. And it worked. I haven't owed, nor paid, employment taxes nor income taxes in years. You appear to be suggesting the statutory route into "wages" is solely responsible for SS tax. Do you think the banksters running this scam have laid out the true nature of their currency scam for all to see?

The question in my mind is... what will you do when it hits the fan Jesse? You can't hide your role in support of this decades old scam. Do you plan to hide from the truth commission? In what corner of the globe?

Thats it .....what?
Who are you to think you can demand me to show you something?
I've shown how the IRS assesses a tax and this endorsement idea after the fact isnt gonna stop them when you have deductions being withheld. Thats my point!
None of you have realized this and just want to argue.

It doesnt matter what you use to get out of participating. The bottom line is you must stop having W3's reported other wise you are having information being reported to the SSA which the IRS uses to determine a refund or deficiency.

So what do you tell people who have deductions taken out and tell them to put exempt on the W4 for no withholdings and endorse their paychecks to rceive lawful money?
You dont realize that the employer is still matching his percentage he required to match for FICA and thats leaving a door wide open for the IRS to come and investigate.
That to me is misleading.

Here an example, lets say a fellow decides to endsorse his paycheck to redeem lawful money and his employer is matching and reporting what his 3121(a) "wages" along with 3401(a) "wages".
Now hes endorsing the check, receiving lawful money and saved enough up to pay fopr a truck out right.
Now a year goes by and the IRS sends him a letter stating he had income the following year and didnt file. So over a course of a few letters the IRS decides to come by and seize the truck for payment of delinquent taxes.
But the truck was paid for with lawful money which is techically lawfully his and cannot be seized because it was paid for with lawful money.
Now what?