Proper way to register a birth

[Keith Alan]

Another maxim, to paraphrase, is that no harm comes from an execution of law.

I see the point about law coming from nothing more than imaginations, and I suppose that is true in a way.

If people agree/consent to abide by an idea, then in effect law is created.

[tommyf350]

It might be a maxim. But after reviewing the statement, I think man creates the law from nothing but his imagination. It seems very fictional to me.

[Keith Alan]

It seems legal fictions come into existance to actually help the people, then the lawyers get a hold of them and then they are used against us.

Maxim - Fictions arise from the law, and not law from the fictions.

[pumpkin]

It seems legal fictions come into existance to actually help the people, then the lawyers get a hold of them and then they are used against us.

[shikamaru]

Ok ,I will do just that. Thanks shikamaru.

Here you go.

Ancient Law - Henry Sumner Maine

[tommyf350]

Ok ,I will do just that. Thanks shikamaru.

[shikamaru]

Check out what I came across . I have not finished reading it but thought it was worth a mention. What I am reading is that the name gives jurisdiction and not redeeming means you're in default.
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/mainea02.asp

You can download "Ancient Law" by Sir Henry Sumner Maine from Google Books.

I would recommend this.

[tommyf350]

Check out what I came across . I have not finished reading it but thought it was worth a mention. What I am reading is that the name gives jurisdiction and not redeeming means you're in default.

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/mainea02.asp

I employ the word "fiction" in a sense considerably wider than that in which English lawyer are accustomed to use it, and with a meaning much more extensive than that which belonged to the Roman "fictiones." Fictio, in old Roman law, is properly a term of pleading, and signifies a false averment on the part of the plaintiff which the defendant was not allowed to traverse; such, for example, as an averment that the plaintiff was a Roman citizen, when in truth he was a foreigner. The object of these "fictiones" was, of course, to give jurisdiction, and they therefore strongly resembled the allegations in the writs of the English Queen's Bench, and Exchequer, by which those Courts contrived to usurp the jurisdiction of the Common Pleas: -- the allegation that the defendant was in custody of the king's marshal, or that the plaintiff was the king's debtor, and could not pay his debt by reason of the defendant's default. But I now employ the expression "Legal Fiction" to signify any assumption which conceals, or affects to conceal, the fact that a rule of law has undergone alteration, its letter remaining unchanged, its operation being modified. The words, therefore, include the instances of fictions which I have cited from the English and Roman law, but they embrace much more, for I should speak both of the English Case-law and of the Roman Responsa Prudentum as resting on fictions. Both these examples will be examined presently. The fact is in both cases that the law has been wholly changed; the fiction is that it remains what it always was. It is not difficult to understand why fictions in all their forms are particularly congenial to the infancy of society. They satisfy the desire for improvement, which is not quite wanting, at the same time that they do not offend the superstitious disrelish for change which is always present. At a particular stage of social progress they are invaluable expedients for overcoming the rigidity of law, and, indeed, without one of them, the Fiction of Adoption which permits the family tie to be artificially created, it is difficult to understand how society would ever have escaped from its swaddling clothes, and taken its first steps towards civilisation. We must, therefore, not suffer ourselves to be affected by the ridicule which Bentham pours on legal fictions wherever he meets them. To revile them as merely fraudulent is to betray ignorance of their peculiar office in the historical development of law. But at the same time it would be equally foolish to agree with those theorists, who, discerning that fictions have had their uses, argue that they ought to be stereotyped in our system. They have had their day, but it has long since gone by. It is unworthy of us to effect an admittedly beneficial object by so rude a device as a legal fiction. I cannot admit any anomaly to be innocent, which makes the law either more difficult to understand or harder to arrange in harmonious order. Now legal fictions are the greatest of obstacles to symmetrical classification. The rule of law remains sticking in the system, but it is a mere shell. It has been long ago undermined, and a new rule hides itself under its cover. Hence there is at once a difficulty in knowing whether the rule which is actually operative should be classed in its true or in its apparent place, and minds of different casts will differ as to the branch of the alternative which ought to be selected. If the English law is ever to assume an orderly distribution, it will be necessary to prune away the legal fictions which, in spite of some recent legislative improvements, are still abundant in it.

[allodial]

AFAIK it went something like this, if a sailor and a barmaid shag in the woods and the barmaid bears kid without a man to claim it or if a kid is born on public liability then the thing to do was to register the birth.

An alternative (or in addition to the Family Bible) is to simple make out a statement or notice or the like that outlines that say on the __ day of ___, 19__ unto said Father or unto said Household the said Child was born on private land near Something-something county, New York without the United States of America. Once can have it witnessed and send it to, say, State Attorney General or some other. One could have it notarized as well. One could file it in the county recorder or in a misc jacket at a USDC. Various options. The State will presume all typically registered births to be "public" and thusly associate them with public offices.

A birth at a hospital facility can still be private. If a child is born "in" a hospital --remember that a hospital is a corporation. The hospital building itself is neither a corporation nor a hospital..obviously.

[shikamaru]

Register .... or record?

[walter]

People used to just write in back of the family Bible.

Recording in gods jurisdiction over the state's jurisdiction.
I have a family bible that has a section in the front for recording birth, wedding, deaths etc.

[pumpkin]

People used to just write in back of the family Bible.

[Keith Alan]

I believe this is where the person is created and those are fictions of law.


PART I
ADMINISTRATION OF THE GOVERNMENT

TITLE I
JURISDICTION AND EMBLEMS OF THE COMMONWEALTH, THE GENERAL COURT, STATUTES AND PUBLIC DOCUMENTS

CHAPTER 4
STATUTES

Section 7
Definitions of statutory terms; statutory construction



Nope, I don't see human being in there at all.

Well, after all its an event that is registered, not a person, although a person is created on that day.

[tommyf350]

I believe this is where the person is created and those are fictions of law.


PART I
ADMINISTRATION OF THE GOVERNMENT

TITLE I
JURISDICTION AND EMBLEMS OF THE COMMONWEALTH, THE GENERAL COURT, STATUTES AND PUBLIC DOCUMENTS

CHAPTER 4
STATUTES

Section 7
Definitions of statutory terms; statutory construction

Twenty-third, "Person'' or "whoever'' shall include corporations, societies, associations and partnerships.

Nope, I don't see human being in there at all.

[tommyf350]

This is for my state. Form R-101, @mass.gov. Shortened to 10000 characters.

The Commonwealth of Massachusetts
Executive Office of Health and Human Services
Department of Public Health
Registry of Vital Records and Statistics

INFORMANT SIGNATURE
STATUTORY AUTHORITY:

"Chapter 46: Section 3A. Hospital administrator's duties; report; verification.
Section 3A.... Such copies shall be signed or otherwise verified by the mother in a manner developed pursuant to regulations promulgated pursuant to section 4 of chapter 17, or, if she is not able, then by the father or other responsible adult, attesting to the truth and accuracy of the facts appearing in the report. Such copies shall also be signed or otherwise verified, in a manner specified under regulations promulgated pursuant to section 4 of chapter 17, by the physician, certified nurse midwife or hospital medical officer in charge of such birth or by an administrator designated by the hospital as overseeing birth registration."

POLICY IN BRIEF
Whenever possible, the Standard Certificate of Live Birth should be fully completed at the hospital or birthing center. Birth records should rarely be left pending for the sole reason of a missing informant signature. In many cases, a registered record can be amended to correct true errors; but, if left unregistered, the record may become a "Delayed Record of Birth" causing the newborn lifetime problems with his or her birth certificate.

In most cases, the mother is the person who will be available to verify the record.

Informants should be provided with a ball-point black ink pen and instructed to bear down so that all three copies of the birth certificate show a visible signature.

Use of the RVRS-provided "Parent Worksheet for Birth Certificates" is encouraged as it provides evidence of parent information for non-parental informants.

RECOMMENDATIONS FOR COMMON SITUATIONS
If a situation falls outside of those listed below, call the Registry of Vital Records and Statistics (RVRS) (617) 740-2605 or -2623 for further instructions. Hospitals and City/Town Clerks may also contact RVRS regarding informant signatures at vital.guideline@state.ma.us.

Parents Married/ Mother's Current Last Name/ Father's Current Last Name/ and Child's Last Name are All the Same

A signature shall be procured consistent with the following priorities:

1.'Mother' or both 'Parents' are the preferred informant(s).
2.If mother is not available, then 'Father' is the next preferred informant.
3.If mother and father are not available, then the hospital administrator in charge of the birth registration unit is the next preferred informant.

Birth certificate preparers should make a reasonable effort to obtain a parent signature within 10 days of the birth. When a hospital administrator signs as informant, it is recommended that a notation be filed with the child's medical record, or other filing system, that indicates the reason why a parent signature could not be obtained.

Parents Married/ Mother's Current Last Name/ Father's Current Last Name/ and Child's Last Name are Not All the Same (including hyphenated, mother retains maiden name, etc.)

A signature shall be procured consistent with the following priorities:

1.Both 'Parents' are the preferred informant.
2.If both parents are not available, then 'Mother' is the next preferred informant.
3.If mother is not available, then 'Father' is the next preferred informant.
4.If mother and father are not available, then the hospital administrator in charge of the birth registration unit is the next preferred informant.

Birth certificate preparers should make a reasonable effort to obtain both parents' signatures within 10 days of the birth. If this is not possible, one parent signature should be obtained. If neither parent signature can be obtained within 10 days of the birth, and no accommodation can be made to obtain the signatures within a reasonable extension, then a hospital administrator should sign the record as informant. It is recommended that documentation should remain with the child's medical record, or other filing system, that shows that the child's name, and other certificate information, is as the parent(s) intended (e.g., Parent Worksheet for Birth Certificates) and why a parent signature could not be obtained. One reason that both parent signatures is desirable (but not required) is to avoid complications later when one or the other parent objects to the last name of the child and tries to correct it.

Mother Not Married/ No Father Listed/ Mother's Current Last Name and Child's Last Name are All the Same

A signature shall be procured consistent with the following priorities:

1.'Mother' is the preferred informant.
2.If mother is not available, then the hospital administrator in charge of the birth registration unit is the next preferred informant.

Birth certificate preparers should make a reasonable effort to obtain a mother's signature within 10 days of the birth. When a hospital administrator signs as informant, it is recommended that a notation be filed with the child's medical record, or other filing system, that indicates the reason a mother's signature could not be obtained.

Parents Not Married/ Acknowledgment of Parentage (and Affidavit of Non-Paternity, if appropriate)

A signature shall be procured consistent with the following priorities:

1.Both 'Parents' are the preferred informant.
2.If both parents are not available, then 'Mother' is the next preferred informant.
3.If mother is not available, then 'Father' is the next preferred informant.
4.If mother and father are not available, then the hospital administrator in charge of the birth registration unit is the next preferred informant.

Two signatures are required for the Acknowledgment (and Affidavit) form(s). In most cases the birth certificate should be prepared and signed at the same time. Parents must use the same signature, when signing as informant, that is used on the Acknowledgment and Non-Paternity forms. If both parents are not available (as when the acknowledgment/ affidavit is sent out of facility to obtain a signature), one parent's signature should be obtained. If acknowledgments/affidavits are correctly completed, but neither parent's signature can be obtained within 10 days of the birth, and no accommodation can be made to obtain the signatures within a reasonable extension, then a hospital administrator should sign the record as informant. It is recommended that documentation should remain with the child's medical record, or other filing system, that indicates the reason why a parent signature could not be obtained on the birth certificate. Notarized signatures on the Acknowledgment are sufficient to show that the name of the child, and other certificate information, is as the parents intended.

Illegible Signatures or Signatures that Do Not Match Names

Informants should sign with their usual signature (as used to sign legal documents, bank checks, and driver's licenses, for example). Although, notarization is not necessary on the informant signature, verification of signature should be requested in cases where the signature is illegible and/or does not appear to match the name on the certificate.

If the signature is illegible, and does not look like the name that appears on the birth certificate, then the birth certificate preparer should verify in the margin of the birth certificate that the signature is that of the mother/father/informant. A notation should appear in the margin of the birth certificate stating "Witnessed By:" with the name and title of the preparer.

If the signature is legible, but does not match the current last name on the birth certificate, the birth certificate preparer should inquire as to whether the listed current name is correct. The information about the mother and father on the birth certificate should reflect the name that the mother/father currently and commonly uses on other current forms of identification. Create a new birth certificate if the current names are not correct. Minor variations in name, such as 'Smith-Jones' on the record and 'Smith' on the signature are not reasons to reject a signature, if the preparer verifies that the names are correct, and the signature is that which is commonly used by the informant.

If neither parent can sign because of illiteracy, a mark (e.g., "X") is acceptable if the notation appears in the margin "Witnessed By:" with the name and title of the preparer.

If the contains non-Roman characters (e.g., Chinese or Cyrillic), ask the parent(s) if they have an English-language signature. If not, a notation should appear in the margin "Witnessed By:" with the name and title of the preparer. If so, the parent(s) should sign in both languages.

"Other" Informants

Other "responsible adults," not included in the priority lists detailed above, that may appear as informant on the birth certificate without prior approval by RVRS include:

Director of Medical Records
Hospital President or CEO

Other non-parent custodial signatures (such as by DSS), are not advised. To provide the newborn with a certificate that looks "normal," even if an adoption or other court action is anticipated, a hospital administrator signature is preferred.

In special situations, such as with deceased parents, close relatives (e.g., mother's parents or sibling) would be acceptable.

Note: Newborn SSN Request may not be Processed if neither Parent is Informant

If the informant is other than the mother or the father, then RVRS may not process a request for a newborn social security card. If neither parent is available to sign, select "No" for "Social Security Card." SSN requests must be initialed on the margin of the record by the mother or by the father (if he is the informant).