Resistance and Refusal by Banks

[shikamaru]

I filed at the County Clerks office....It is a public record. I was studying the Libel of review, but it is beyond my knowledge, so far.

I think I gained some more insight, as what I learned is there are four different actions you can take against the gov...Administrative, Civil, Criminal, Admiralty.

The way I understand it, Admiralty is what taxes are collected under.... I think the Libel of Review is filed under the admiralty side of court?....

Let's clean up this taxonomy a bit....

There are (were) 4 types of courts in the US:

a) common law or courts at law
b) equity
c) admiralty/maritime
d) administrative.

Courts at law and courts in equity have been merged into one as to its proceedings. However, their respective bodies of laws and remedies have not been merged. Don't expect any attorner to inform you of the latter.

Proceedings of courts in equity, in admiralty/maritime, and administrative courts all have their roots in Roman Civil Law.

Equity has no criminal form of action. I'd dare say that neither does administrative courts.

Equity was merely a remedial branch of law (Law of Remedies) historically before becoming a substantive branch of law over time.

A historical substantive branch of law (in England) that has no jurisdiction here in the States is Ecclesiastical Law. Ecclesiastical Law has its roots in Roman Civil Law as well.

There are two principal divisions of forms of action:
a) Civil
b) Criminal

In courts at law, there were multiple causes of actions, but since the merger of courts at law and in equity, there is only a single cause of action (civilly) which is called a pleading. Government still maintains common law on the criminal form of action side (for itself).

[David Merrill]

Regarding 'even if the bank subsequently gives you difficulty and maybe rejects it and you have to change the non-endorsement...', are you referring to being rejected after the 3-day binding agreement? (another suitor mentioned this 3-day window as learned here at STSC). I believe they can outright refuse your novation prior to this window, correct?

I need to read and research creating an 'evidence repository'. I take this to be filing public record documents, such as one suitor filed his demand at the County Clerks office so it was 'on the record'.

Actually I do not think so. I believe that the shareholders and board of directors would be very upset to discover that the manager is turning down opening accounts without a good reason legally.

[David Merrill]

Let's clean up this taxonomy a bit....

There are (were) 4 types of courts in the US:

a) common law or courts at law
b) equity
c) admiralty/maritime
d) administrative.

Courts at law and courts in equity have been merged into one as to its proceedings. However, their respective bodies of laws and remedies have not been merged. Don't expect any attorner to inform you of the latter.

Proceedings of courts in equity, in admiralty/maritime, and administrative courts all have their roots in Roman Civil Law.

Equity has no criminal form of action. I'd dare say that neither does administrative courts.

Equity was merely a remedial branch of law (Law of Remedies) historically before becoming a substantive branch of law over time.

A historical substantive branch of law (in England) that has no jurisdiction here in the States is Ecclesiastical Law. Ecclesiastical Law has its roots in Roman Civil Law as well.

There are two principal divisions of forms of action:
a) Civil
b) Criminal

In courts at law, there were multiple causes of actions, but since the merger of courts at law and in equity, there is only a single cause of action (civilly) which is called a pleading. Government still maintains common law on the criminal form of action side (for itself).

Thank you!

I don't think I have ever read such a succinct explanation. Here is a paper about it.

[shikamaru]

The way I understand it, Admiralty is what taxes are collected under.... I think the Libel of Review is filed under the admiralty side of court?....

The collection is administrative. How many people do this of their own volition?

The court proceedings and how they are conducted, that's where the admiralty is.

Taxes may be tied in, anciently, with gifting and Roman Civil Law.

Remember in England, the king had a court dedicated exclusively to his royal revenues: the Court of the Exchequer.

[EZrhythm]

Excellent explanations Shika! I agree very succinct.

[EZrhythm]

Excellent explanations Shika! I agree very succinct.

[David Merrill]

Actually I do not think so. I believe that the shareholders and board of directors would be very upset to discover that the manager is turning down opening accounts without a good reason legally.

Quoting myself there.

[gdude]

Well, I wanted to post an update to my U.S. Bank R4LM. This morning I went to my online account and there was no checking or savings account! I was furious, as they never contacted me to tell me they were, in fact, closing the account. All this happened after I had a direct deposit from my work.

I called the local branch and they put me on hold for 10 minutes and came back to confirm that my account, had indeed, been closed because I did not sign a new sig card. What if I had written a check on the account?...do you think they would have charged me an overdraft fee???!!! Hell yes.

I asked the minion " Is US bank giving me legal advice? You are telling me how to sign a contract. Sounds like legal advice to me, do you realize it is a federal offense to dispense legal advice if you are not a lawyer?"

She said that they were not giving legal advice and that the sig card was a contract APPROVED BY THE GOVERNMENT and when I added verbage it changed their contract. I said it is perfectly within my right to change any contract if I am to sign under penalty of perjury. She said that their terms say that they can close any account for any reason! I did not have the time today to look it up....very stressful day without this BS.

I told her I have a valid signed contract (past it's 3 day trial period)....

On a different note I did mail my notarized Demand to the Treasury, Local Fed, and my old bank where I still have an account (good thing I did not close it out and change all my Online bill payments! I would be switching them all back.

I am just curious as to any response I will receive from any of the recipients. Wonder if we should send a copy to auntie?

As far as the US bank fiasco, there was another aspect that I did not like....signing the card as "True Name signing for the US PERSON-FIRST M LAST". I did not create this US PERSON, and I certainly do not consent to having me Family name stolen!

I think next time I will cross out "US PERSON" and write in "citizen of these United States of America" or "American citizen" or "man".

Thoughts?

[David Merrill]

Do you have the Return Receipt or Delivery Confirmation of your Notice and Demand that you sent to the Fed bank?

If Yes; you can clear this all up easily then. Go down to the bank and sign the Signature Card simply, the way they want. [Or if you want to mess with them just sign "Lawful Money" and tell them that is your signature from now on.] Then have a process server serve the Proof of Service with the Notice and Demand that you served on the Fed.

Now the bank is on notice that you served the Notice and Demand on the Fed and they should open up the accounts and go back to regular business. Technically they are in charge of R4C with the Signature contract. You have finally pressed the envelope of fiduciary responsibility too far, for at least one bank anyway.


Regards,

David Merrill.

[gdude]

Thanks David, Interestingly enough, the only return receipt I've received so far is from the Dept of Treasury. I'm done with US bank, left a bad taste. I like my current bank, Suntrust, but I opened that account in mid 90s. I did send them a Demand also, but they may try to ignore it, or maybe say that I am trying to change the terms of the adhesion contract. BUT, 12USC411 only says you have to make a demand, not that any principle players have to agree to it....correct?

[shikamaru]

.... been closed because I did not sign a new sig card.

Holy crap. My bank did the exact same thing to me, but on a different issue.

[gdude]

VERY TELLING, isn't it?

[David Merrill]

Thanks David, Interestingly enough, the only return receipt I've received so far is from the Dept of Treasury. I'm done with US bank, left a bad taste. I like my current bank, Suntrust, but I opened that account in mid 90s. I did send them a Demand also, but they may try to ignore it, or maybe say that I am trying to change the terms of the adhesion contract. BUT, 12USC411 only says you have to make a demand, not that any principle players have to agree to it....correct?

How can they ignore a demand?

You really have to study that one!

They have no control over your voice. You may voice any demand you like. If you get it across with proof then they cannot ignore your demand. Especially in these cases where they close the accounts. They are responding to your demand - not ignoring it. That is how I take your Tell - Gdude. It is a Tell, that your demand has substance.

These banks are suddenly realizing that they cannot ignore your demands for lawful money. Check out this thread! 55 Views but not a single Post in response? So I suspect my point needs a little more clarifying.

I like my current bank, Suntrust, but I opened that account in mid 90s. I did send them a Demand also...

There is a little more of it right there! Displacement.

What you should have done is serve Suntrust with certified copy of your proof of service in the nearest Fed Bank - of your Notice and Demand. Albeit sending them a demand is probably adaquate but if push comes to shove are you not going to have to summon the bank manager into open court? This is what evidence repositories are about. The certification I am speaking of is from the US clerk of court and the Notice and Demand will not only be notarized you get a Commission Certificate from the Secretary of State on the Notary Public too. If you prove all the facts then no attorney will ever take you to court!

No law or fact shall be tried in court.

If the facts are already on the record then holding court for a finding of fact is fruitless!

[allodial]

There might be merit in dealing directly with the pertinent Federal Reserve branch as in notifying /cc'ing them of the intent to denominate all transactions in lawful money. If the bank is in a particular FRB district, then perhaps your account is too. The first two digits of the routing number indicates the Federal Reserve District (territory of the United States?) that the account and bank are in no?

[gdude]

I did send my DEMAND by USPS certified to the Dept of Treasury, the local Fed bank, and my current bank. I received signature pages for every thing but my current bank! Dept of Treasury and local FED were my concerns.