Persuasion & PSYOPS: The Elaboration Likelihood Model

[doug555]

Because the "bill" represents public debt amidst the "commercial war" stemming from the United States government bankruptcy; and, also represents the amount of credit requested for settlement which can only be released by the source of all credit - the living man who makes up part of the whole public. The U.S. Treasury is the public pool belonging to the people. The account of the United States is the property of the people and, when properly utilized, one of the people directs the drawer/payee of a "bill" to the "Drawee" (U.S. Treasury) for payment processing.

YES !!! That is why I assert and maintain that the "bill" is truly a "credit voucher" sent to us for us to approve it by indorsing/acknowledging that one of the people did actually receive the good/service in order to legitimately reduce the national debt owed to the people by the United States by the sum certain amount stated on said "bill".

[allodial]

YES !!! That is why I assert and maintain that the "bill" is truly a "credit voucher" sent to us for us to approve it by indorsing/acknowledging that one of the people did actually receive the good/service in order to legitimately reduce the national debt owed to the people by the United States by the sum certain amount stated on said "bill".

If it is a "credit voucher", then what account might the credit be in?

Because the "bill" represents public debt amidst the "commercial war" stemming from the United States government bankruptcy; and, also represents the amount of credit requested for settlement which can only be released by the source of all credit - the living man who makes up part of the whole public. The U.S. Treasury is the public pool belonging to the people. The account of the United States is the property of the people and, when properly utilized, one of the people directs the drawer/payee of a "bill" to the "Drawee" (U.S. Treasury) for payment processing.

But...what if... maybe ... Verizon has been doing all of that.. 'processing' and such inside ...

Verizon.

[Anthony Joseph]

If it is a "credit voucher", then what account might the credit be in?



But...what if... maybe ... Verizon has been doing all of that.. 'processing' and such inside ...

Verizon.

You mean 'double enrichment"?

It is a bonus when people send in the 'coupon' "with their payment". But what process is utilized if only the amount is filled out on the coupon, conventionally speaking? Can 'Verizon' negotiate that instrument on its own? Is receiving the signed check enough to also release the credit on the coupon by attaching them together?

That would mean 'Verizon' knows how to handle such instruments in commerce and must accept the 'coupon' only as "payment in full" when tendered properly.

[doug555]

If it is a "credit voucher", then what account might the credit be in?



But...what if... maybe ... Verizon has been doing all of that.. 'processing' and such inside ...

Verizon.

Good questions!

Loan Accounting gives us a clue...

Lawful Money Full Discharge Instrument-ACCOUNTING does too...

But we, as Beneficiaries, do not need to know that... we specify the WHAT ("I authorize payment"), the Trustee's duty is to know and do the HOW ("discharge upon payment").

IMO, all they really need is our signature across the face of the "bill".

But, to SHOW WE HAVE ELABORATED, this STAMP is recommended (K.I.S.S.).

And isn't every corporation really acting as an Agent of the Treasury/Trustee anyways, as a sub-corp of the US Corp?

So, as agents of the principal/trustee, they should know HOW to handle getting a credit from the trustee, right?

So, let's hold them accountable, and if they fail to perform, that is outside the scope of their principal/agent agreement, and then can be held liable. This is where a CLAIM comes into play in a Court of Record, for harm to a man.

See this Conditional Acceptance for BILL that has worked for me in the past in that regard... with several entities...

PM me for private details...

[froze25]

I'm having a challenge with these links Loan Accounting*gives us a clue...Lawful Money Full Discharge Instrument-ACCOUNTING*does too...

Suggestions?

[doug555]

I'm having a challenge with these links Loan Accounting*gives us a clue...Lawful Money Full Discharge Instrument-ACCOUNTING*does too...

Suggestions?

Thanks for the feedback... they should work now... refresh your browser to reload that page, if needed.

[allodial]

You mean 'double enrichment"?

It is a bonus when people send in the 'coupon' "with their payment". But what process is utilized if only the amount is filled out on the coupon, conventionally speaking? Can 'Verizon' negotiate that instrument on its own? Is receiving the signed check enough to also release the credit on the coupon by attaching them together?

That would mean 'Verizon' knows how to handle such instruments in commerce and must accept the 'coupon' only as "payment in full" when tendered properly.

Again, Central Route Processing + being single minded. If you truly believe the voucher is a check or has value as a check, then perhaps it might be best to dismiss any contrary thoughts or beliefs so as to avoid wavering? If it is to be a payment of some kind then it must be unconditional whether payable to order or not, right? What can the recipient of an incomplete bill do with it? If you truly believe that is a check basically then who or what is it to be made payable to? If you don't know how to complete the coupon, presuming there is some value or sense in doing so, is that Verizon's fault?

Re: "Double Enrichment"
Related: "double taxation", "double jeopardy".

[Anthony Joseph]

Alright then.

Then this would be the method which VERIZON would be able to "clear" payment.

[allodial]

Consider: One hundred and twenty-three and 45/100ths dollars lawful money. I am convinced they even taught people to write amounts in words wrong. "One thousand fifty dollars" would mean $1,000 x $50 compared to "one thousand and fifty dollars" in the same way fifteen hundred dollars is resolved that "fifteen" acts on "hundred dollars" giving you 1500. Consider "one thousand twenty five dollars" vs "one thousand and twenty-five dollars" vs "one thousand and twenty five dollars" (interpret-able two ways $1025 or $1,020 x $5). American football player vs American-football player (American modifies football and is a singularity modifying 'player'). Amounts in words is said to trump numbers. Handwriting trumps typewriters which trumps print.

Alright then.

Then this would be the method which VERIZON would be able to "clear" payment.


[ATTACH=CONFIG]1534[/ATTACH]

If the voucher is of any value, it would seem that what Verizon wants is to have the credit they have set aside taken from the account and paid into their general ledger, no?

[Anthony Joseph]

Well, is it a

Voucher

or

Coupon

Most often, somewhere in the presentment, it is referred to as a 'coupon'.

That means it is a "certificate of interest due on a bond"; and, a "piece cut off" to present for payment.

A 'thing certified' (paper memorial of a claim requiring verification) of a 'legal claim or right' due on a "something that binds" (debt).

So, "cut it off" and present it for payment.

[doug555]

RE: Thread: Persuasion & PSYOPS: The Elaboration Likelihood Model

Perhaps http://iuvdeposit.wordpress.com/hjr-192/ and HJR 192 - Indorsement is Payment will help bring this issue into clearer focus...

Then compare this to the IRS position on payments at http://www.irs.gov/Payments and see if they are violating the terms of HJR 192 by only allowing only one "kind" of coin or currency, namely liability currency.

See my "Conditional Acceptance" of said position.

Does this help increase the ELABORATION LIKELIHOOD for this issue?

Shouldn't this be the KEY ISSUE for CENTRAL ROUTE PROCESSING at this point in America today with its debt ceiling and deficit crises?

Shouldn't this be the KEY ISSUE to bring before a COMMON LAW GRAND JURY (http://iuvdeposit.wordpress.com/grand-jury) in each county?

Doesn't compelled use of liability instruments in direct violation of HJR 192 constitute the imposition of involuntary servitude/slavery by perpetual indebtedness?

Does't this provide probable cause to bring forth claims of harm and injury to every man and woman so compelled?

Once one returns an indorsed bill along with a Notice and Demand and this payment is dishonored without cause?

THINK/ELABORATE on this...

PM me if you want to discuss this privately. We need to form a private FOCUS GROUP on this issue ASAP.

NOTICE: See the new TOPIC for this focus at: The KEY ISSUE for a COMMON LAW GRAND JURY

[allodial]

Well, is it a

Voucher

or

Coupon

Most often, somewhere in the presentment, it is referred to as a 'coupon'.

That means it is a "certificate of interest due on a bond"; and, a "piece cut off" to present for payment.

A 'thing certified' (paper memorial of a claim requiring verification) of a 'legal claim or right' due on a "something that binds" (debt).

So, "cut it off" and present it for payment.

(law library)--To raise the bar...

I reiterate a key point: in their eyes, you are likely expected to be an expert concerning the laws, principles, customs and the like pertaining to promissory notes, contracts, bills of exchange, guarantees and the like--not anyone else. The point is important because it really gets at the heart of the solution.

P.S. I figure anyone that is truly serious about the topic would eagerly and gladly make their way through even a stack of 700 page law books on the matter. This is a very specialized and technical topic.



I tend to figure that anyone alleging interest in this topic that is utterly unwilling to read a book like that from covert to cover or even the most important parts isn't at all serious and just wants to blame someone else for their dismay. You want to best Ninja and Samuris? Hmmm I suspect you'd do best to be training somewhere...somehow. What is amusing, there books covering the likes of vouchers and coupons in beautiful detail and that have been available online for over ten years and I've yet to see any site related to A4V or 1099-OID or the like even so much as mention them.

..So, "cut it off" and present it for payment.

If that is what it is, unless someone has studied the law of bills of exchange, promissory notes how would they know how to present it for payment? An angry article about the alleged demise of America isn't probably going to help much without the motivation to actually get into the practical. This stuff isn't locked away in some Vatican library. Although it just happens to *not* be tattooed to Nikki Min*j's, Br*tney Spe*r's or Myley Cyr*s's breasts.

10 seconds of G***gle searching and clicking I found this. Saved me from having to pull a book from my shelf. I got to stay in my comfy chair.

[Anthony Joseph]

Downloaded both texts by CANNON and STORY from achive.org.

Began reading CANNON and now will cross-reference STORY; hopefully I can glean practical information and put it into practice. Both are lengthy and intensive reads, but well worth it if one gains practical knowledge of these instruments and their proper application/use.

[allodial]

There is a free 24-page primer on negotiable instruments called "Law of Negotiable Instruments" by a (US Army) Major D.H. Boughton. It is worth nothing that promissory notes and bills of exchange or subsets of contract law. Non-negotiables are important too. Promissory notes that are not negotiable might be best considered in light of "Statutes of Anne" referred to in the Boughton book. If Joseph Story's writing stile isnt working for you, you might consider Chitty's work of which I would consider Chapters I, II and III to be mandatory reading.

[Anthony Joseph]

Some "central route processing" has provided me with two scenarios regarding handling the instrument:

1) The remitter (whoever sent it to you) owes your account (the acct. number on the 'bill') and sends the coupon/voucher ('bill') for your indorsement (signature creates the positive credit) and will deposit said instrument into the account when you send it back properly indorsed. They are the printer of the "check" and the "teller" who will deposit the funds in said account once the instrument is indorsed.

2) The person (entity/vessel created by the United States - name on the account of the 'bill') owes the account and the sender of the 'bill' seeks an authorized signature for credit transfer from the source of all credit; 'man'. The 'man' authorizes the credit transfer, through the person (transmitting utility) and the 'biller' receives the funds and indorses for deposit into the account.

Number (1) scenario would require the 'man' to sign the back of the instrument (no other markings anywhere) with his authorized signature and send in for deposit into the account.

Number (2) scenario would require the 'man' to fill out the front of the instrument (like a conventional check) and send it in for the receiver to indorse the back and deposit.

What say you?