Massachusetts Passports (1857 Law)

[allodial]

For your information...

[allodial]

Below is a scan of Massachusetts passport from 1831.

[shikamaru]

A little filler from what I can recall, passports are wartime implements.

[allodial]

A little filler from what I can recall, passports are wartime implements.

Pretty much. Since WWII there have been 'standing wars'. Since Civil War, there have been US implements for 'prosecution of war'. Imagine, because someone else had a fight 'you' get the have the burden of proving that you are or aren't involved.

[Jethro]

Very interesting, allodial! Anyone know if this Act was ever expressly repealed?

[allodial]

Very interesting, allodial! Anyone know if this Act was ever expressly repealed?

I am unaware of it being repealed. As I mentioned, diplomatic credentials were handed out by states in the 80s until the Office of Foreign Missions was established. AFAIK, that didn't necessarily mean the states couldn't do it anymore just that the OFM started doing it so they didn't have to.

Consider the significance that all U.S.A. Secretaries of State issue Apostilles rather than one. Apostilles are diplomatic in nature.

[Jethro]

I am unaware of it being repealed.

If that's the case, it would serve as very strong evidence that there are at least two citizenships available for the purposes of a passport -- U.S. citizen and State Citizen. It would also imply there is a choice between the two, and the choice made is voluntarily.

It would be fantastic to find out for sure if it's been repealed, and if not, find each State's equivalent and start making passport requests at the State level!

[allodial]

If that's the case, it would serve as very strong evidence that there are at least two citizenships available for the purposes of a passport -- U.S. citizen and State Citizen. It would also imply there is a choice between the two, and the choice made is voluntarily.

It would be fantastic to find out for sure if it's been repealed, and if not, find each State's equivalent and start making passport requests at the State level!

There is plenty of case history. Citizenship with respect to a state still exists to this day. Distinct from citizenship is nationality. And yes one can volunteer into U.S. citizenship--a Citizen of one of the several states can volunteer into the U.S. Army for example.

[allodial]

This is from a The Miller and Simmons Families: Genealogy and History Documents, Volume 1:

[allodial]

Abstract from a Mississippi Territorial passport of 1802:


Source: Mississippi Territorial Archives 1798-1803 - Executive Journals of Governor Winthrop Sargent and Governor Williams Charles Cole Clairborne

[Jethro]

There is plenty of case history. Citizenship with respect to a state still exists to this day. Distinct from citizenship is nationality. And yes one can volunteer into U.S. citizenship--a Citizen of one of the several states can volunteer into the U.S. Army for example.

I agree. If these statutes remain unrepealed, that means a "State Citizen" can apply for a passport via his State; and that the State must provide him such a passport.

Unless, of course, none of the original States are in operation anymore.

[allodial]

I agree. If these statutes remain unrepealed, that means a "State Citizen" can apply for a passport via his State; and that the State must provide him such a passport.

Unless, of course, none of the original States are in operation anymore.

They are still in operation. Also, there be Nationals not just Citizens.

[walter]

state or federal, does it matter?
still property that is not yours.

what is a passport? (beyond the definitions)

to me its ownership,
after all its just ID'ing what jurisdiction is responsible for the user/holder.

[allodial]

state or federal, does it matter?
still property that is not yours.

what is a passport? (beyond the definitions)

to me its ownership,
after all its just ID'ing what jurisdiction is responsible for the user/holder.

If there is verbiage on it that says that its your private property, how that would ring true? Its not just "ID" it contains the order to allow passage to the one identified. Organic state or Federal , big difference. In Germany, there are the lander (states) which created the German Democratic Republic. There is a similar setup there.

[Jethro]

They are still in operation.

If that's the case, AND the state statutes permitting state-issued passports remain unrepealed, then the states must issue such passports to those who request them.

This is worth looking into further.