Another trick courts are using re: R4C

[David Merrill]

I have some questions. I have read through the thread here.

Do you have a collateral evidence repository? I asked you by inserting the question on Page 1 in red; maybe you missed it? You seem confused when I started speaking like you knew about this. You are behooved to have a case opened in the USDC to acquire the 'exclusive original cognizance' of the US government with the federal clerk of court. This is what we (William THORNTON and myself) mean by court of record. If you are letting them keep the only record then you make them the court of record even though they are technically a court not of record.

The other thing; did you hand the police officer a driver license? How did you sign it?

If you signed it with your legal name then you have already identified yourself to the court through that signature.

When you approached the bench with that R4C in hand, it should have been marked a true and correct copy of the document in your USDC evidence repository by the US clerk of court. Was it?


Please forgive me if I have missed something or forgotten details.

[David Merrill]

I should not speak for William THORNTON just because I have seen him lecture. What I am saying is that he would not disagree with the statute-described definition.

ANNOTATION

The acts of a court of record are known by its records. Judicial records are not only necessary but indispensable to the administration of justice. The court judgments can be evidenced only by its records. The acts of a court of record are known by its records alone and cannot be established by parol testimony. The court speaks only through its records, and the judge speaks only through the court. Herren v. People, 147 Colo. 442, 363 P.2d 1044 (1961).

Look at the Colorado Constitution though:

Section 23. Trial by jury - grand jury. The right of trial by jury shall remain inviolate in criminal cases; but a jury in civil cases in all courts, or in criminal cases in courts not of record, may consist of less than twelve persons, as may be prescribed by law. Hereafter a grand jury shall consist of twelve persons, any nine of whom concurring may find an indictment; provided, the general assembly may change, regulate or abolish the grand jury system; and provided, further, the right of any person to serve on any jury shall not be denied or abridged on account of sex, and the general assembly may provide by law for the exemption from jury service of persons or classes of persons.

But you saw in the statutes:

TITLE 13. COURTS AND COURT PROCEDURE
COURTS OF RECORD
ARTICLE 1.GENERAL PROVISIONS
PART 1. ADMINISTRATIVE PROVISIONS

C.R.S. 13-1-111 (2012)

13-1-111. Courts of record



(1) Each of the following courts shall have a seal and shall be a court of record:

(a) The supreme court;

(b) The district courts;

(c) The county courts;

(d) The juvenile court in the city and county of Denver;

(e) The probate court in the city and county of Denver;

(f) Any court established by law and expressly denominated a court of record;

(g) Repealed.

(h) The court of appeals.

Therefore a traffic trial in front of a jury of six is a court not of record, with no authority except what you have granted by letting it get that far.

I hope you are starting to get clear of the sinking feeling.

If you become the court of record then start keeping a record of the judge's and prosecutor's oaths of office - the DA too. Know the bill of rights and put them on notice in open court that they cannot proceed as a court not of record. If it was here then that means the judge would have to set a panel of twelve and of course his oath would be in the record etc. If you know the Bills of Rights then mind his "p"s and "q"s for him. As soon as he has violated your rights tell him the deal is off. If he insists on proceeding then let him know what you charge for such a performance if he forces you to be an actor.


A lien is not the way to go for you though, from what I have read above. You will likely end up in prison unless you can get your mind wrapped around record forming.



Regards,

David Merrill.

[KnowLaw]

I apologize for not responding before now. We had a storm go through our area on Sunday and the power was out for a day and a half, and during that my phone went down so I haven't had Internet capability for the past four plus days. The court hearing for arraignment was Tuesday morning, so the prior two days I was busy dealing with the power outage and unable to continue preparing properly (not that it would have done any good) for the court matter. So, I got steamrollered (cognitive dissonance) in that first hearing. Took me half a day just to figure out what happened! I'm not very good in verbal jousting, thinking on my feet (unless I have a good foundation in the material of study, which in this case I didn't).

I'll respond to the questions posed in your first post, David, then address your second post, which I found intriguing. Hopefully, we can make this thread helpful to others who find themselves in a similar situation. A kind of "step one: do this; step two, do that" etcetera.

I have not set up an evidence repository with the USDC. But I do keep a personal evidence repository of all things filed (affidavits, citations, letters and such) concerning any issue at hand so that I can submit them when needed. And yes, I agree with your statement following; this is my intention and what I'm doing at present: "If you are letting them keep the only record then you make them the court of record even though they are technically a court not of record."

2nd question: No. I don't have a driver license. He took the information from an invalid computer record of my canceled (in my eyes; suspended in theirs) auto registration (haven't figured out how to get rid of the Certificate of Title to the car). I signed "without prejudice" above my First Middle name. The judge acknowledged that in court when I mentioned it.

3rd question regarding a true and correct copy of the document in your USDC evidence repository: This is irrelevant (not applicable since there is no USDC repository). I did tender a photocopy of my original photocopy of the refused for cause presentment, the original Defendant's copy of which went back to the issuing officer. I also tendered my Certificate of Mailing.

Re: Your 2nd post.

It's Thursday afternoon and I still do not have Internet capability (service techs have not shown up yet), so I haven't been able to access the links in your second post yet. I was able to post the request to my thread using a local Library WiFi. Didn't have much time to do much else.

This is the area where I need specific details about how to go about accomplishing the general instructions provided in your reply. I've never done any of this before, so its all new to me! I'm learning on the fly. I am able to follow detailed instruction, though. I just need to know where to go to obtain the information or documents needed, or a sample of a Notice and Demand letter so that I can write one applicable to my matter.

While this is all second nature to you, how do I get hold of the judge's and prosecuting attorney's oaths of office? Where do I need to go to obtain certified copies, and will it cost very much? Is it really necessary to obtain (in this instance) the DA's oath? Is a DA likely to be brought into a municipal city matter like this?

"Know the bill of rights and put them on notice in open court that they cannot proceed as a court not of record." Okay. Excuse me for possibly being obtuse here. So how would I go about doing this? What words would I use, what legal issues need to be emphasized? How would I go about doing this in open court? I read in a Court Survival Guide I downloaded from the old Worldnewsstand.net website something about filing a request for a Special Appearance. This, presuming the judge approved it, would allow me to have a hearing to address just this matter, yes.

If yes, then this presents another obstacle for me. I've never seen a request for Special Appearance. Where could I find a sample similar to what I need to have done? And do I need to specify in the request what the special appearance is in regard to? (Sorry for all the questions; I just don't want to make any mistakes. I just need directions to know where and what to look for.)

"As soon as he has violated your rights tell him the deal is off. If he insists on proceeding then let him know what you charge for such a performance if he forces you to be an actor." Okay. Again, how would I phrase this? I presume this would be done in open court, too.

I'm much better with producing paperwork for the record than in having to joust with a judge or prosecutor in court. Is there any way that I can get things on the record through the use of affidavits and other such notices?

Some additional information you need to know:

I previously filed with the state Dept. of Transportation and the County Sheriff and subsequently with the county recorder back in 2008 a sworn Affidavit of Administrative Notice regarding the travel issue. I used this affidavit in a previous traffic stop by a highway patrolman who basically ignored it, but which matter was settled in a justice court with a R4C presentment that I was able to enter into the court case file prior to any court appearance. It was therefore within the court's cognizance.

Might this affidavit be used in this instance as a prior "notice to principal is notice to agent" type thing where the gov't agencies were legally put on notice about this matter? A copy of the affidavit is attached. (Sorry for the wordpad text file; system wouldn't allow rich text format.) I ask this because of the following, which I found in my research:

Commercial processes (including this affidavit and the required responses to it) are non-judicial and pre-judicial because:

a) No judge, court, government, or any agencies thereof, or any other third parties whatsoever, can abrogate anyone's affidavit of truth; and

b) Only a Party affected by an affidavit can speak and act for himself and is solely responsible for responding with his own affidavit of truth, which no one else can do for him.

No third party can invalidate someone's affidavit of truth. To act against such an affidavit is to create a situation and/or enhance the condition of a Mixed War.

A Mixed War condition exists where "authorities" have violated their oaths of office, violated the fundamental law they swore to uphold and protect, violated the codes, statutes, and regulations that govern them and in so doing disregard the peace and safety of the community by their acts, operating as Agents for undisclosed Foreign Principals or Governments against those whom they swore to protect. Such acts of Treason constitute a secret war against the people.

I'm not sure how a municipal court judge of no record would handle this submission. It is obviously coming from a jurisdiction (common law) foreign to his own. But when it said: It is pre-judicial and "No judge, court, government or any agencies thereof. . . can abrogate anyone's affidavit of truth," that pretty much told me that this was powerful stuff. It seems to override any government's jurisdiction. Whether or not they recognize it, though, is another story.

Maybe obtaining the oaths of office, swearing out an affidavit of accepting the oaths of office of both the judge and prosecuting attorney, and submitting that along with the Affidavit of Administrative Notice to the court somehow (not sure whether I can just submit it into the case file or whether I need to request a Special Appearance hearing to do it). Any ideas about this?

Just occurred to me: In the Court Survival Guide it mentioned a strategy to put in a Motion To Withdraw Plea "to remove your implied consent to the court's jurisdiction. By vacating your plea of Not Guilty, technically the venue and Jurisdiction is removed. So here is where you can again use the Notice of Special Visitation and of Foreign Law, and the Judicial Notice of Military Flag and Challenge of Jurisdiction. Make sure the court agrees to vacate your previous Plea, before you say anything more. Before you are required to enter a new Plea, present these 2 notices and demand the resolution of jurisdiction.

"Now the court will now be up against the wall, because it must stop everything and make a legal determination as to whether the court even has jurisdiction. Because it no longer has your plea, it no longer has your consent to their implied and assumed jurisdiction."

I'd rather do something that doesn't require me to speak much, but just enter paperwork on the record to challenge jurisdiction. Don't want to get crossed up like the first time, when I wasn't prepared for the judge's reply. The devil is in the details in this! But if I know ahead of time how he is likely to respond, then I can have a statement ready to rebut (or whatever) his reply. As long as I know what to say (no matter what he may say, if he's being belligerent) I'll be okay.

It says in the Court Survival Guide about this: "Immediately Motion for Dismissal for lack of jurisdiction, as soon as they try to dance around it. If the judge doesn't dismiss the case now, then Object, or Recuse (dismiss) the Judge for obvious bias against you, and place him/her on notice of your intent to Appeal his/her judicial error. This is their mistake for sure." That is, recuse the judge and demand a hearing in a judicial court of record. So I guess that answers my question about what to do if the judge tries to wiggle out of dismissing the case.

Thank you for any information you may be able to provide.

[David Merrill]

I apologize for not responding before now...

I'll respond to the questions posed in your first post, David, then address your second post, which I found intriguing. Hopefully, we can make this thread helpful to others who find themselves in a similar situation. A kind of "step one: do this; step two, do that" etcetera.

I have not set up an evidence repository with the USDC...

2nd question: No. I don't have a driver license. He took the information from an invalid computer record of my canceled (in my eyes; suspended in theirs) auto registration (haven't figured out how to get rid of the Certificate of Title to the car). I signed "without prejudice" above my First Middle name. The judge acknowledged that in court when I mentioned it.

Technically you have won your case. At trial you ask the arresting officer how you identified yourself? Suppose you told the officer you are First Middle and he did not believe you? However it would be good if you gave him some kind of ID card with First Middle on it - even a driver license signed "First Middle" is good. Before I had a WSA ID card I carried a Certificate of Search from the USDC on David Merrill.

By bringing out the testimony that he never heard you when you identified yourself however, you expose an error in jurisdiction.

3rd question regarding a true and correct copy of the document in your USDC evidence repository: This is irrelevant (not applicable since there is no USDC repository). I did tender a photocopy of my original photocopy of the refused for cause presentment, the original Defendant's copy of which went back to the issuing officer. I also tendered my Certificate of Mailing.

There is a recognized legal principle that, if "all" judges have conflicts of interest, then "any" judge can hear the case. (The issue comes up from time to time in cases involving the compensation of judges or other matters affecting all judges.) - United States v. Will, 449 U.S. 200 (1980).

Without an evidence respository the court not of record is holding the highest record.

Re: Your 2nd post.


This is the area where I need specific details about how to go about accomplishing the general instructions provided in your reply. I've never done any of this before, so its all new to me! I'm learning on the fly...

While this is all second nature to you, how do I get hold of the judge's and prosecuting attorney's oaths of office? Where do I need to go to obtain certified copies, and will it cost very much? Is it really necessary to obtain (in this instance) the DA's oath? Is a DA likely to be brought into a municipal city matter like this?

The DA is responsible for the legal training of police officers. This oath of office is bogus and exposes a vacant DA office. See below how there is no oath before God as prescribed by tradition and by statute? In Colorado county and municipal oaths are found at the county clerk and recorder while all district and state oaths are found at the secretary of state. Here is a valid oath; see how it looks like a bond. Look at Dan MAY's $5K insurance policy again. Pathetic! All that is to me is a confession that he knows his oath of office is bogus!

The acquirement of oaths must be convenient and cheap, wherever you are in America.

"Know the bill of rights and put them on notice in open court that they cannot proceed as a court not of record." Okay...


I am really talking about reading the bills of rights in your state and the federal constitutions. All actors who have sworn to uphold the constitutions (presuming all the oaths are valid) must adhere to these rights. In your situation you are probably sunk on most of the other issues; like how to abate for misnomer etc. that may fly, maybe not but you have to wait until you are in the fire to see if the extinguisher is full if you know what I mean. You will probably win by insisting on a court of record and since it is a court not of record you have to demonstrate competence by forming the record yourself. With that (and all the oaths of office) in the Record then you will be able to do things like (if you were in Colorado) make the judge form a panel of 12 jurors for traffic court. The judge would be so reluctant to do that he would likely beg the prosecutor to lose the witness and throw the trial.


If yes, then this presents another obstacle for me. I've never seen a request for Special Appearance. Where could I find a sample similar to what I need to have done? And do I need to specify in the request what the special appearance is in regard to? (Sorry for all the questions; I just don't want to make any mistakes. I just need directions to know where and what to look for.)

I am speaking about a Restricted Appearance Rule E(8) in the US District Court and simply to form the Record with a competent clerk of court.


"As soon as he has violated your rights tell him the deal is off. If he insists on proceeding then let him know what you charge for such a performance if he forces you to be an actor." Okay. Again, how would I phrase this? I presume this would be done in open court, too.

I'm much better with producing paperwork for the record than in having to joust with a judge or prosecutor in court. Is there any way that I can get things on the record through the use of affidavits and other such notices?

Some additional information you need to know:

I previously filed with the state Dept. of Transportation and the County Sheriff and subsequently with the county recorder back in 2008 a sworn Affidavit of Administrative Notice regarding the travel issue. I used this affidavit in a previous traffic stop by a highway patrolman who basically ignored it, but which matter was settled in a justice court with a R4C presentment that I was able to enter into the court case file prior to any court appearance. It was therefore within the court's cognizance.

Might this affidavit be used in this instance as a prior "notice to principal is notice to agent" type thing where the gov't agencies were legally put on notice about this matter? A copy of the affidavit is attached. (Sorry for the wordpad text file; system wouldn't allow rich text format.) I ask this because of the following, which I found in my research:

Possibly. What I see is that you are getting your mind wrapped around record forming. Get it into the Record of the muni court. It should show that it is in the record of the Administrative Agency you mentioned though - marked by them and returned or have a certificate of mailing etc.

I'm not sure how a municipal court judge of no record would handle this submission. It is obviously coming from a jurisdiction (common law) foreign to his own. But when it said: It is pre-judicial and "No judge, court, government or any agencies thereof. . . can abrogate anyone's affidavit of truth," that pretty much told me that this was powerful stuff. It seems to override any government's jurisdiction. Whether or not they recognize it, though, is another story.

Maybe obtaining the oaths of office, swearing out an affidavit of accepting the oaths of office of both the judge and prosecuting attorney, and submitting that along with the Affidavit of Administrative Notice to the court somehow (not sure whether I can just submit it into the case file or whether I need to request a Special Appearance hearing to do it). Any ideas about this?

Yes! That sort of thing. If you have been keeping Return Receipts and such then you are keeping a record! The USDC evidence repository is a competent clerk for you to use in the cognizance of the US government.

Just occurred to me: In the Court Survival Guide it mentioned a strategy to put in a Motion To Withdraw Plea "to remove your implied consent to the court's jurisdiction. By vacating your plea of Not Guilty, technically the venue and Jurisdiction is removed. So here is where you can again use the Notice of Special Visitation and of Foreign Law, and the Judicial Notice of Military Flag and Challenge of Jurisdiction. Make sure the court agrees to vacate your previous Plea, before you say anything more. Before you are required to enter a new Plea, present these 2 notices and demand the resolution of jurisdiction.

Indeed you will screech the proceedings to a halt every time you mention, I have not been arraigned. However that continues from Square One and will land you an appointment with a court-appointed psychologist for a competency hearing. That could be deadly or destroy your mind over a traffic matter?


"Now the court will now be up against the wall, because it must stop everything and make a legal determination as to whether the court even has jurisdiction. Because it no longer has your plea, it no longer has your consent to their implied and assumed jurisdiction."

I'd rather do something that doesn't require me to speak much, but just enter paperwork on the record to challenge jurisdiction. Don't want to get crossed up like the first time, when I wasn't prepared for the judge's reply. The devil is in the details in this! But if I know ahead of time how he is likely to respond, then I can have a statement ready to rebut (or whatever) his reply. As long as I know what to say (no matter what he may say, if he's being belligerent) I'll be okay.

(Continued)

[David Merrill]

(Continued from above)

It says in the Court Survival Guide about this: "Immediately Motion for Dismissal for lack of jurisdiction, as soon as they try to dance around it. If the judge doesn't dismiss the case now, then Object, or Recuse (dismiss) the Judge for obvious bias against you, and place him/her on notice of your intent to Appeal his/her judicial error. This is their mistake for sure." That is, recuse the judge and demand a hearing in a judicial court of record. So I guess that answers my question about what to do if the judge tries to wiggle out of dismissing the case.

Thank you for any information you may be able to provide.

I have never read the Court Survival Guide and do not even have an unread copy in my library.

One thing I note though is that most of these manuals do not consider that the judge considers you a willing actor and as such he has full jurisdiction until things are proven otherwise.

A court-martial always has jurisdiction to determine whether it has jurisdiction...

So is the condition of the ongoing Emergency still manifest in the economy. Page 1. Page 2.

A practical way to view the same scenario is that the judge is preparing you for your day in court. It is only after conviction (or under oath on the stand) that the court will be hearing from you. Until then all the judge hears is your attorney. It is called allocution.

See that? Entered into the record.

If you want my advice though, plead out and pay up. All this about record forming and being the court of record is something to have between your ears before you get into this kind of trouble. If you got into an accident and broke a little kid's arm could you be responsible? That is key to being competent.

The Suitors I speak of here mostly have driver licenses that they sign "First Middle" complete with registration (no tax) and insurance. The others who drive have a bond (they are wealthy). Suitors are competent and that is synonymous with responsible.

Mainly though you can teach yourself the proper redemption model of Jesus CHRIST by making your demand for lawful money. That can teach you to wrap your mind around remedy (redemption).

[Michael Joseph]

Speaking of tricks. A friend of mine showed me THIS today.

I heard recently that the CEO of Starbucks is pushing towards no cash policy. It won't be too long before the clerk is looking for your DL - and oh by the way, can you give me your SSN before I refill that cup. Just sign here.

Conditioning 101. Its Convenient.

[David Merrill]

Speaking of tricks. A friend of mine showed me THIS today.

I heard recently that the CEO of Starbucks is pushing towards no cash policy. It won't be too long before the clerk is looking for your DL - and oh by the way, can you give me your SSN before I refill that cup. Just sign here.

Conditioning 101. Its Convenient.

(a) Except as otherwise provided in this section, whoever, in any matter within the jurisdiction of the executive, legislative, or judicial branch of the Government of the United States, knowingly and willfully?

(1) falsifies, conceals, or covers up by any trick, scheme, or device a material fact;
(2) makes any materially false, fictitious, or fraudulent statement or representation; or
(3) makes or uses any false writing or document knowing the same to contain any materially false, fictitious, or fraudulent statement or entry;

shall be fined under this title, imprisoned not more than

May I serve that with a Criminal Complaint?

[KnowLaw]

Some thoughts about your reply

I just received an envelope from the law office of the appointed attorney. I'm not opening it. Depending on the ideas I express as you read throughout the rest of this reply, would you concur that I should refuse it as "Return to Sender improperly addressed." It's addressed to First, Middle Initial, Last name. Just checking, really. It's an offer to contract. If they try to force it on me, I'll use your suggestion: "My fee is half a million dollars if you want me to act in that capacity." Counter offer!

Might this affidavit [of Administrative Notice] be used in this instance as a prior "notice to principal is notice to agent" type thing where the gov't agencies were legally put on notice about this matter? A copy of the affidavit is attached. (Sorry for the wordpad text file; system wouldn't allow rich text format.) I ask this because of the following, which I found in my research:

Possibly. What I see is that you are getting your mind wrapped around record forming. Get it into the Record of the muni court. It should show that it is in the record of the Administrative Agency you mentioned though - marked by them and returned or have a certificate of mailing etc.

Yes, I have a certificate of mailing for that affidavit sent to the agencies from four years ago of which I will need to get a certified copy made so that I can preserve the original for future use.

I'm still needing some input on this as I'm thinking of possibly entering this document (Affidavit of Administrative Notice) at a certain stage in the proceedings in order to have the judge (after I have accepted his oath) sign an Order of the court testifying to the court's recognition of the validity of this affidavit. This Order would be so I could hand out the Court Order after serving notice with the affidavit to any LEO in the future who might stop me thinking he has a citation victim.

I'm not sure how a municipal court judge of no record would handle this submission. It is obviously coming from a jurisdiction (common law) foreign to his own. But when it said: It is pre-judicial and "No judge, court, government or any agencies thereof. . . can abrogate anyone's affidavit of truth," that pretty much told me that this was powerful stuff. It seems to override any government's jurisdiction. Whether or not they recognize it, though, is another story.

Maybe obtaining the oaths of office, swearing out an affidavit of accepting the oaths of office of both the judge and prosecuting attorney, and submitting that along with the Affidavit of Administrative Notice to the court somehow (not sure whether I can just submit it into the case file or whether I need to request a Special Appearance hearing to do it). Any ideas about this?

Yes! That sort of thing. If you have been keeping Return Receipts and such then you are keeping a record! The USDC evidence repository is a competent clerk for you to use in the cognizance of the US government.

Yes, I have been keeping certificates of mailing (they are less expensive than return receipts on registered mail) and forming a record. I've always had my head wrapped around record forming ever since I first read your recommendation for it.

Just occurred to me: In the Court Survival Guide it mentioned a strategy to put in a Motion To Withdraw Plea "to remove your implied consent to the court's jurisdiction. By vacating your plea of Not Guilty, technically the venue and Jurisdiction is removed. So here is where you can again use the Notice of Special Visitation and of Foreign Law, and the Judicial Notice of Military Flag and Challenge of Jurisdiction. Make sure the court agrees to vacate your previous Plea, before you say anything more. Before you are required to enter a new Plea, present these 2 notices and demand the resolution of jurisdiction.

Indeed you will screech the proceedings to a halt every time you mention, I have not been arraigned. However that continues from Square One and will land you an appointment with a court-appointed psychologist for a competency hearing. That could be deadly or destroy your mind over a traffic matter?

Okay. I didn't have in mind to follow the Court Survival Guide's strategy exactly as it is laid out after the plea was withdrawn (filing the notices and all). The idea I meant to imply was to use this method of backing the court out of its jurisdiction, then using that opportunity to guide the judge (forming an agreement) by asking for a clarification of certain things before I enter a new plea. This is a very tricky approach, because I need make certain that the old plea has first been vacated (jurisdiction removed) before I propose the idea of needing clarification so that I can make an informed and reasonable determination about which plea I wish to enter. You see?

For instance (to the judge), [Oh, by the way, I accept your oath and bond as binding placing you under penalty of perjury.] So, I can plead "guilty" or "nolo contendre." However, am I not entitled to understand these procedures before I undergo them? Isn't one of the duties of the court to make sure the defendant understands everything that is happening? I need some clarification about the implications of each of these pleas before I can make a reasonable determination which way I want to go. What are the differences in the legal significance of each of these pleas after the deed is done? (Let the judge make his statement.)

Just so I understand what occurred at the arraignment, because this would affect how I might plead, I need to clarify something about that occurrence and then ask you a question about that which I still don't understand. [Now we're back at the point where I screwed up at the arraignment and didn't object after the judge's outburst about the court's jurisdiction. This is just a rough sketch of what I have in mind. I need to think about this more, to improve on the limitations I'm placing on the judge in this instance.]

When you made your statement about jurisdiction and the statutes involved, there was nothing about what you were saying that I disagreed with, which was why I didn't object. Given the correct circumstances, of course the court must be able to establish jurisdiction over the matter before it can proceed.

No. What I had in mind, and what I failed to bring out in that instant, was the fact that the matter had been refused for cause, which means, if I understand this correctly, and you can correct me if I'm wrong, that the plaintiff now has the obligation to bring verified proof of claim and enter that upon the court record. This is not the court's obligation in this instance. There is case law which states:

HAGANS vs LAVINE (415 US 533): "Once JURISDICTION is challenged it must be proven by the Plaintiff."

What I had in mind, but failed to communicate, because I'm not familiar with the ways of legal procedure in court, was the written established challenge to personam jurisdiction that was entered upon the record, and which the court was supposed to have cognizance of before I even entered the room. If the officer did not communicate that document to the court, then there was a fraud in the makings. And my intention was to correct that fraud. I do not see where the plaintiff has rebutted that challenge on the record with a verified complaint from a flesh and blood victim who has been injured. Isn't this a requirement in all criminal cases? That a competent witness come forward with a notarized affidavit demonstrating an injury. (Let the judge make his statement.)

In light of these facts, I fail to see how I am able to make a plea to a non-existent case.

[David Merrill]

Speaking from experience scripts fail. Especially with the chief judge in home rule municipal jurisdiction. All he is doing is presuming you want a day in court, a fair trial. He does not see you or hear you. He sees and hears only your attorney.

Write across the Letter - Return to Sender with an arrow back to his return address. Black through your address information and the light yellow barcodes. Mark clearly in red: YOU ARE NOT AND YOU NEVER WERE MY ATTORNEY!

Take three copies (write the case# on the copies) of the letter to the post office and ask the clerk to please rounddate your three copies for evidence that you have sent that letter back to the attorney. If they want to charge you to send it back tell them that is not your name on it. [When you give somebody your name you give them power of attorney over you.]

Take your three copies to the DA's office. Give the receptionist one and have her/him mark your two copies received, time and date with initials. Take the two marked copies to the courthouse and find the clerk. File one and get the second marked Filed.

Now you are pro se, in the eyes of the court. The "judge" gave you a couple weeks to find an attorney or you are It, right?

I am not going to encourage all this script because I do not believe in it. The judge will mow you down and proceed on the premise the defense attorney he is speaking with is looking for a trial, or is incompetent to defend you. If you are incompetent to stand trial you might be steered into a psychological exam.

There is a possibility that the judges sometimes clear nuisance cases off the docket like you have said. The City will be paying $2K for that psychological exam for example. If the judge is sure that you are just a sovereign citizen then he might not want to pay for your philosophy and so you walk. But if you are just going to go back to driving around without a license, I doubt it. He has a duty to the citizens as I explained; the only way for you to get that done in Colorado is to set a $30K (last I checked many years ago) bond. If you will not be responsible for that kid on the bicycle, for breaking his arm with your car, then you cannot get this done in my opinion.

Now let's pretend that you succeed in the billing cycle, past due notice and cure a proper lien against the State for $20M. You might post that lien as your bond, that might cause some discussion.

[Michael Joseph]

Speaking from experience scripts fail. Especially with the chief judge in home rule municipal jurisdiction. All he is doing is presuming you want a day in court, a fair trial. He does not see you or hear you. He sees and hears only your attorney.

A presumption of trust. He appears therefore he trusts. Meaning why would I ask anything of you IF I do not trust you? I once heard a police officer tell a young protege of mine "if you stay I am going to have to arrest you." When he asked me what I thought he should do I simply said "he is telling you if you stay seeking His Judgment, then you have placed your trust in Him making Him your Sovereign, so LEAVE." He told the PO to have a nice day and he turned and left.

Jurisdiction perfected in Trust - He Trusts by implication of his Faith in Deed - he appears and asks for Judgment - Please, will you dismiss the charges, Please? I have wonderful arguments, if only you will hear them. The Tyrant's response: trial day is set on [insert date].

Before we proceed, if we proceed, I have a few MORE questions.....

[KnowLaw]

Speaking from experience scripts fail. Especially with the chief judge in home rule municipal jurisdiction. All he is doing is presuming you want a day in court, a fair trial. He does not see you or hear you. He sees and hears only your attorney.

Okay. I was thinking that they (the courts) have come up with a way to preclude that kind of thing. So, that information about Withdrawal of Plea is probably dated and not useful now. They've seen it before, and come up with a way to get around it. (Just speculating here.)

Write across the Letter - Return to Sender with an arrow back to his return address. Black through your address information and the light yellow barcodes. Mark clearly in red: YOU ARE NOT AND YOU NEVER WERE MY ATTORNEY!

Take three copies (write the case# on the copies) of the letter to the post office and ask the clerk to please rounddate your three copies for evidence that you have sent that letter back to the attorney. If they want to charge you to send it back tell them that is not your name on it. [When you give somebody your name you give them power of attorney over you.]

Take your three copies to the DA's office. Give the receptionist one and have her/him mark your two copies received, time and date with initials. Take the two marked copies to the courthouse and find the clerk. File one and get the second marked Filed.

Now you are pro se, in the eyes of the court. The "judge" gave you a couple weeks to find an attorney or you are It, right?

What I need to know is the procedure about this appointing an attorney. From what you just wrote, it doesn't seem as though I am locked in yet. I'm not sure the judge gave me anything of the kind with regard to finding an attorney. I don't remember a lot of what he was saying at the hearing. It went by pretty quickly, and I have trouble keeping up with things. But perhaps you are correct. Might the Muni court have a transcript of the hearing (tape recorded, I presume) that I could apply for a copy of in forma pauperis?

At present, I'm not sure what is the best option for me to take, so I will keep this in the background. I haven't returned the attorney's letter yet. Just marked it. Will need to ask more questions in order to better determine an answer. It may be that it's more advantageous to go through the trial, and wait for an opportunity at allocution. What do you think, given the circumstances? It seems like my best chance to get the truth on the record.

I am not going to encourage all this script because I do not believe in it. The judge will mow you down and proceed on the premise the defense attorney he is speaking with is looking for a trial, or is incompetent to defend you. If you are incompetent to stand trial you might be steered into a psychological exam.

There is a possibility that the judges sometimes clear nuisance cases off the docket like you have said. The City will be paying $2K for that psychological exam for example. If the judge is sure that you are just a sovereign citizen then he might not want to pay for your philosophy and so you walk. But if you are just going to go back to driving around without a license, I doubt it. He has a duty to the citizens as I explained; the only way for you to get that done in Colorado is to set a $30K (last I checked many years ago) bond. If you will not be responsible for that kid on the bicycle, for breaking his arm with your car, then you cannot get this done in my opinion.

Yes, the bolded statement above is what I had planned to do. I believe it's $30K here in Arizona also. I've downloaded information about creating a bond; I'll have to dig it out and see if you think it will fly. It worked at one time.

The last time I was in court for this I still had insurance on the auto. That probably had something to do with the outcome at that time. Do you think?

Now let's pretend that you succeed in the billing cycle, past due notice and cure a proper lien against the State for $20M. You might post that lien as your bond, that might cause some discussion.

You lost me here. I have little idea what you are talking about. I'm not familiar with the info. This would need to be explained more fully for me to understand.

Before I read your reply above, I typed out a brief outline of the situation as it currently stands, at least as I understand it. I will post that next to see what kind of comment it draws.

[KnowLaw]

(Preface: My phone, and therefore Internet capability, is going to be impaired for at least another week due to the demand for repairs in my area after the storm that went through on the 9th, so I'm unable to research this at home and must find WiFi spots to connect.)

Let me try to outline the situation as it presently stands.

1. The Muni court judge has assumed jurisdiction based on my not having objected to his assertion of such at the arraignment.

2. After the above mentioned occurrence in #1, the judge then accepted my papers proving "refused for cause" was properly served, because now he has jurisdiction and the papers can be ignored. The refused citation clearly shows a reservation of rights (without prejudice) signed above my First Middle signature, which the judge acknowledged after gaining jurisdiction.

3. The judge then, over my stated objection which he recognized in court, created paperwork to appoint an attorney for me. The paperwork states that I am not to contact the attorney before Sept. 24. (So, I'm wondering if there is something I can do before then -- make motions, submit affidavits or whatever -- in an attempt to regain some personal control over the proceedings.) Does anyone know the significance of not contacting the attorney?

4. The judge then created paper work for the setting of a trial, bypassing Preliminary Hearing and Pretrial. There's a box checked that reads: "Appear at a mandatory pretrial conference per attached notice." I'm not sure what this is in reference to. And I don't know what the "attached notice" is in reference to since there isn't any. The only papers I have are: a document stating the name address and phone number of the appointed attorney; an Order Regarding Counsel appointing the attorney; and the document ordering me to appear at trial on Nov. 27th. So, I'm not sure what this "attached notice" is in reference to.

5. Trial was set for November 27 at 2:00 pm.

6. Judge asked before closing the proceeding: "Do you have anything you want to say?" Not being aware (at that moment) of the opportunity to object, I missed an opportunity to object to the proceedings and withdraw consent.

7. I was released on my own recognizance and ordered not to "drive."

Given these circumstances, I need to know how I can proceed to endeavor to get the truth of the situation on the record, and also what I can legally do to influence the situation from this point on, seeing as an attorney has been appointed (who I have yet to see or contract with).

Some thoughts that have occurred to me, although I don't know if I am allowed to file anything to get it on the record (even though I haven't accepted the attorney; I realize the attorney is being forced on me at this point "under protest"). I'm just putting these out to see if there is something positive I can do to begin influencing the direction of things:

1. File an affidavit revoking power of attorney of gov't officials.

2. File an affidavit accepting the oath of office of the judge and prosecuting attorney (supplied with certified copies of said oaths to establish a record) putting them on notice to follow their constitutional duties. (I also have an Affidavit of Administrative Notice, which was recorded and sent four years ago to the State Dept. of Transportation and the County Sheriff -- with proof by certificate of mailing -- but these would need to be recognized in a court that is superior to the inferior court with which I am presently entangled to be effective.)

3. File a Motion to Withdraw Plea (to establish a hearing). I don't think this would do any good if I were still under the power of attorney of the attorney appointed. Am I correct in that assumption? In other words, he would be in control of any dealing with the judge at the hearing and not myself. I would not be able to ask my questions in the way and under the circumstance that I want in order to establish on the record certain facts. (David made this clear in his last reply, so this point can be disregarded.)

4. There is something I read recently about "assistance of counsel" I believe it is called. Does anyone know anything about this and its significance?

5. Will a notice of violation of Title 18 Sec. 241 (Conspiracy against rights) to the gov't "actors" have any effect on these actors? Or will it just cause them to fly off the handle and issue threats. (On second thought, this might not be a good idea.)

What I'm endeavoring to determine is: what procedures am I able to use that they cannot block. If I'm unable to accomplish anything in the above list, then it seems that I have no other alternative than to endure the trial. At which point I will have an opportunity at allocution to enter testimony.

I need some clarification about allocution and what, beyond saying "I do not consent to these proceedings," that I can bring out. I read that one can bring out defects in pleadings, at which point I can point out that I am not in receipt of a verified complaint, etc. The plaintiff has an obligation under the ruling in Hagans vs Lavine (415 US 533) to provide evidence on the record to rebut the challenge. But also that this matter was "refused for cause" at the outset, but said refusal was not recognized by the court. This would also be a good point to bring in the Affidavit of Administrative Notice recorded at the county recorder.

Right about now, I'm feeling as though that sinking feeling has abated somewhat, and that I have a chance to set the record straight. (On second thought, maybe not.)

[David Merrill]

The system of thought is become the court of record by keeping the record.

I don't remember a lot of what he was saying at the hearing. It went by pretty quickly, and I have trouble keeping up with things.

So you keep an audio recorder in your shirt pocket. Then you can order up the transcript and compare. There is a lot of intelligence to be found in what the "judge" instructs be removed by the transcriber. If he adjusts it at all, then he is not a court of record any more. But since you have an accurate recording, you are. You might use the Libel of Review to set up an evidence repository; a Record in the care and custody (trust) of the US clerk of court. You become the court of record. [The case gets dismissed but you continue using it for an evidence repository - the Record.]

The approach you are using here and on SuiJurisClub is quite uneffective in my opinion. You are silly to try allowing voices on the Internet to advise you in such hybrid and scripted responses. Awaiting that magic moment - the window of allocution - that is just plain risky. In my opinion you would be best off to get your mind wrapped around these topics while able to enjoy yourself and the learning process. Not while under the gun.

Did you put together a portfolio of the actors' oaths of office yet?

What I teach record-forming. When you get that between your ears you grasp how to redact the situation to simply holding the actors to their oath as a fungible fidelity bond. Look at that Lien. It has the oaths being violated in the "collateral" field.


Regards,

David Merrill.

[Seosaidh]

A presumption of trust. He appears therefore he trusts. Meaning why would I ask anything of you IF I do not trust you? I once heard a police officer tell a young protege of mine "if you stay I am going to have to arrest you." When he asked me what I thought he should do I simply said "he is telling you if you stay seeking His Judgment, then you have placed your trust in Him making Him your Sovereign, so LEAVE." He told the PO to have a nice day and he turned and left.

Jurisdiction perfected in Trust - He Trusts by implication of his Faith in Deed - he appears and asks for Judgment - Please, will you dismiss the charges, Please? I have wonderful arguments, if only you will hear them. The Tyrant's response: trial day is set on [insert date].

Before we proceed, if we proceed, I have a few MORE questions.....

Your comment to your protogete shows you know how to think on your feet. Makes me wonder what the police officer thought.

[KnowLaw]

The system of thought is become the court of record by keeping the record.

Okay. I'm beginning to focus in on this. This not having access to the Internet is killing me. I just spent the whole day writing a reply which I'm not going to post because I can see that it is mostly irrelevant to what you are trying to pound into my head. If I had seen your comment earlier [it's 8 PM here as I write] I wouldn't have wasted so much time accomplishing nothing.

So you keep an audio recorder in your shirt pocket. Then you can order up the transcript and compare. There is a lot of intelligence to be found in what the "judge" instructs be removed by the transcriber. If he adjusts it at all, then he is not a court of record any more. But since you have an accurate recording, you are. You might use the Libel of Review to set up an evidence repository; a Record in the care and custody (trust) of the US clerk of court. You become the court of record. [The case gets dismissed but you continue using it for an evidence repository - the Record.]

I'm not able to sneak an audio recorder into the courtroom. (Don't even have one to begin with.) So, I'm up a creak on that. But yes, I see your point about keeping my own record. I've been hoping to do that with affidavits, to establish a record. Any chance I can use affidavits?

Also, I haven't pulled the trigger yet on canning the appointed attorney. Just holding onto the letter they sent without opening it. I'm not sure the judge will allow me to go pro se. I need more clarity about what course of action to take and why I'm taking it.

Had a chance to glance briefly over the Libel in Review (on the fly while composing this reply, so will need more time to study it later). That certainly looks interesting. I see why you recommend it. It gets the matter on record.

The approach you are using here and on SuiJurisClub is quite ineffective in my opinion. You are silly to try allowing voices on the Internet to advise you in such hybrid and scripted responses. Awaiting that magic moment - the window of allocution - that is just plain risky. In my opinion you would be best off to get your mind wrapped around these topics while able to enjoy yourself and the learning process. Not while under the gun.

Did you put together a portfolio of the actors' oaths of office yet?

Haven't had an opportunity yet. I need all three oaths, is that correct? Won't fly with just two? Need to bring the District Attny into it? (I'm thinking out loud here; please indulge me.) The DA because that ties him to the Libel of Review? I'm just trying to understand.

I've mostly been trying to come to some clarification about the real situation that's facing me before taking any action. That's why I've been asking so many questions. My questions have been in the vein of elimination of methods of approach, asking people's opinions, attempting to ascertain their experiences.

I agree about the comment about allocution. But at the moment, that's the only thing that's providing me with any hope.

What I teach record-forming. When you get that between your ears you grasp how to redact the situation to simply holding the actors to their oath as a fungible fidelity bond. Look at that Lien. It has the oaths being violated in the "collateral" field.

I'm trying to follow you here, but I'm not sure I correctly understand. What do you mean by the term "fungible fidelity bond"? You're using terms I have no idea what you are talking about until you explain them to me.

I presume you are referring to the following, which I still do not understand what it is or how it is created! Or how it might effect things.

...and cure a proper lien against the State for $20M. You might post that lien as your bond, that might cause some discussion.