Exactly what does the IRS agent think?

[froze25]

What's in your wallet? Indeed... But, once lawful demand is made, the FRNs become USNs.... dual purpose Notes as the Treasury FAQ says...

[ATTACH]1843[/ATTACH]

could you provide a link to the page that says that FRNs are dual purpose and serve as USN's? I can only find that FRN's serve the same function as USN's but not that they are dual purpose or that they may act as USN's. On there website. http://www.treasury.gov/resource-cen...al-tender.aspx

[Brian]

could you provide a link to the page that says that FRNs are dual purpose and serve as USN's? I can only find that FRN's serve the same function as USN's but not that they are dual purpose or that they may act as USN's. On there website. http://www.treasury.gov/resource-cen...al-tender.aspx

Froze...I don't think there is a statute or reg or decision that specifically call this out. I think this is where metaphysics comes into play. If the FRN's are discharged by notice & demand then they would essentially be treated as USN's.

The questions I would ask then is: can my demand be considered inherent and my notice is this conversation.

[doug555]

could you provide a link to the page that says that FRNs are dual purpose and serve as USN's? I can only find that FRN's serve the same function as USN's but not that they are dual purpose or that they may act as USN's. On there website. http://www.treasury.gov/resource-cen...al-tender.aspx

http://www.treasury.gov/resource-cen...al-tender.aspx

What are United States Notes and how are they different from Federal Reserve notes?
United States Notes (characterized by a red seal and serial number) were the first national currency, authorized by the Legal Tender Act of 1862 and began circulating during the Civil War. The Treasury Department issued these notes directly into circulation, and they are obligations of the United States Government. The issuance of United States Notes is subject to limitations established by Congress. It established a statutory limitation of $300 million on the amount of United States Notes authorized to be outstanding and in circulation. While this was a significant figure in Civil War days, it is now a very small fraction of the total currency in circulation in the United States.

Both United States Notes and Federal Reserve Notes are parts of our national currency and both are legal tender. They circulate as money in the same way. However, the issuing authority for them comes from different statutes. United States Notes were redeemable in gold until 1933, when the United States abandoned the gold standard. Since then, both currencies have served essentially the same purpose, and have had the same value. Because United States Notes serve no function that is not already adequately served by Federal Reserve Notes, their issuance was discontinued, and none have been placed in to circulation since January 21, 1971.

The Federal Reserve Act of 1913 authorized the production and circulation of Federal Reserve notes. Although the Bureau of Engraving and Printing (BEP) prints these notes, they move into circulation through the Federal Reserve System. They are obligations of both the Federal Reserve System and the United States Government. On Federal Reserve notes, the seals and serial numbers appear in green.

United States notes serve no function that is not already adequately served by Federal Reserve notes. As a result, the Treasury Department stopped issuing United States notes, and none have been placed into circulation since January 21, 1971.

I am basing my comment on above highlighted statement on the FAQ...

[walter]

What's in your wallet? Indeed... But, once lawful demand is made, the FRNs become USNs.... dual purpose Notes as the Treasury FAQ says...

BTW: Notice that the FRS Seal on the left side of top $5 is missing...

[ATTACH]1843[/ATTACH]

Whats in your wallet? Your richer then you think.
I always chuckle when I hear that line.

Whats the letter "B" for on the Fed note? (center left)
Bonded? Bankrupt? Borrowed? Bullshit? etc.

[doug555]

Whats in your wallet? Your richer then you think.
I always chuckle when I hear that line.

Whats the letter "B" for on the Fed note? (center left)
Bonded? Bankrupt? Borrowed? Bullshit? etc.

http://www.littletoncoin.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Display%7C10001%7C10001%7C-1%7C%7CLearnNav%7CFederal-Reserve-Districts.html

[Keith Alan]

Froze...I don't think there is a statute or reg or decision that specifically call this out. I think this is where metaphysics comes into play. If the FRN's are discharged by notice & demand then they would essentially be treated as USN's.

The questions I would ask then is: can my demand be considered inherent and my notice is this conversation.

I wonder why - since when one makes his demand, the US always subsequently defaults - the US would ever challenge your considering of FRN as USN.

[bsperlazzo]

Several Dead Links

Several of the links in the original post (see below) are dead links.
Could someone please update the post and submit correct links?

Thanks!

Required Reading. His boss tells him what he has to read, to train him about the guidelines about when to issue a warning or $5K penalty for a frivolous filing.

I invite even the most skeptical readers to find a directive about redeeming lawful money as framed in the Fed Act and Title 12.

http://www.irs.gov/taxexemptbond/20k...134362,00.html - notices

http://www.irs.gov/newsroom/article/0,,id=168637,00.html

Notice 2007-61

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-drop/n-07-30.pdf

http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/3498/frivolouspositionsmemor.pdf

Notice 2007-30

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-drop/n-08-14.pdf

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/3498/frivolouspositionsmemor.pdf

Notice 2008-14

http://www.irs.treas.gov/pub/irs-drop/n-10-33.pdf

http://img862.imageshack.us/img862/3498/frivolouspositionsmemor.pdf

Notice 2010-33

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-ccdm/cc-2011-004.pdf

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-utl/friv_tax.pdf

Notice 2011-004


To save time I suggest keywords to search:


lawful
redeem
redemption
Title 12
411

[David Merrill]

Thank you for mentioning it! I have edited the opening post with the Memorandums. There is not much I can do about the pages the IRS has removed.

[Chex]

http://www.campaignforliberty.org/na...rtys-property/

When the IRS Attacks http://www.campaignforliberty.org/na...g/irs-attacks/

Select Your State http://www.campaignforliberty.org/community/#mapanchorhttp://www.campaignforliberty.org/re...it-fed-effort/

[Mark Allan]

The question for me is; how is it Line 21 - Other Income has been defined as to where Redemption of Lawful Money is properly stated?
I ask this group why not, possibly, Line(s) 40, & or 42 wouldn't be the much more logical avenue.

Other Income Line 21 as a < > negative number just seems confusing.
Is it we are trying to modify, break the connection to the presumption of Income?

Whereas, Line 40 Deductions seems so much easier & logical to express there, and more aligned with what presumably, IRS might be better able to process.

What is presently define as "Standard Deduction" is $1000 for a filing individual..., (UNLESS like myself, I can't claim ANY Standard Deduction, as current rules apply that, if your spouse files separately, AND includes Itemized Deduction(s), filer, (me) is NOT allowed to take the "Standard Deduction")

As learned, probably on this site, that $1000 is "allowed" since it is the presumption of your usage of United States coinage. [Lawful Money].
So, in this regard, this is where IRS is pointing to filers as to where to place Lawful Money deductions...., in my opinion.
Granted, there are defined constraints & restrictions, and boundaries around "deduction(s)", but this really shouldn't be any different in practice than accessing & utilizing Line 21 - Other Income(?), except a Filer will then be entering $ amounts, but in positive numbers.
This just seems more aligned with the published law & ongoing practice of finding & utilizing deductions, to reduce / lower presumed Income.

I suggest Lawful Money is a deduction, not necessarily confined to use on Line 21.
While it has certainly shown itself to be practical, to this point, is it possible another valid approach might be usage of Line 40, and or Line 42?

Additionally, for myself, I would suggest Line 42 may also serve my filing needs, since this line is where Exemptions are stated.
For 2013 Filing, a wet ink - updated W-4 was provided to my employer with Line 7 informing on my "Mandatory Exception per 12 USC 411.

Being this Thread is ~ "What does an ...think?:, anybody care to weigh in?

One last point; since I have yet to receive my 2013 Federal 1040 refund, I maintain IRS is improperly holding my Lawful Money - refund, since on & for the Record, before any payment entries are ever made to me, what WILL be paid to me is demanded, Lawful Money.

IRS believes it is retaining my paid in withholding on presumed tax due for Income.
By my accounting, IRS is in possession of, (my) Lawful Money.
They wrongly think it to be tax receipts since it was given to them by my employer.

Mark Allan

[martin earl]

"One last point; since I have yet to receive my 2013 Federal 1040 refund, I maintain IRS is improperly holding my Lawful Money - refund, since on & for the Record, before any payment entries are ever made to me, what WILL be paid to me is demanded, Lawful Money."

I agree, what's more, they are demanding I pay them a 10000 $ penalty for noticing them of my demanded redemption via the 1040!

So, I think I will NOTICE them of the facts!

[Michael Joseph]

"One last point; since I have yet to receive my 2013 Federal 1040 refund, I maintain IRS is improperly holding my Lawful Money - refund, since on & for the Record, before any payment entries are ever made to me, what WILL be paid to me is demanded, Lawful Money."

I agree, what's more, they are demanding I pay them a 10000 $ penalty for noticing them of my demanded redemption via the 1040!

So, I think I will NOTICE them of the facts!

I am seriously considering a class action lawsuit against the IRS. Will the judge be willing to overturn the law? What I mean is this:

Job 10:15 If I be wicked, woe unto me; and if I be righteous, yet will I not lift up my head. I am full of confusion; therefore see thou mine affliction;

So I find that the Name is a Person of State and therefore will the State rely upon the Policy of Necessity or will truth win out? Nevertheless, I shall remain righteous and call upon Heaven to record the events to be held over until Judgment Day. In other words, the State might just take the same position as Creator - so whether the End User be righteous or not, it does not matter - in the light of Policy.

Therefore, even though I will march into the fire, my King may deliver me or not, it is up to my King. ALL THINGS are under the feet of Jesus Christ - ALL THINGS. Thus the witness.

Where two or more are gathered in my name....Class Action.

Mat 18:15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.

Mat 18:16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.

Mat 18:17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.

Mat 18:18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Mat 18:19 Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.

Mat 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

All offices of State are Ecclesiastical. So if I go privately and am met with repugnance, then I am to go again with a witness. And then I will proceed before the Public - Class Action complaint. How am I to initiate that action - I claim in the name of Jesus Christ in and to the THING. I am a Witness to His Glory.


Shalom Brethren,
Michael Joseph

[doug555]

I am seriously considering a class action lawsuit against the IRS. Will the judge be willing to overturn the law? What I mean is this:

Job 10:15 If I be wicked, woe unto me; and if I be righteous, yet will I not lift up my head. I am full of confusion; therefore see thou mine affliction;

So I find that the Name is a Person of State and therefore will the State rely upon the Policy of Necessity or will truth win out? Nevertheless, I shall remain righteous and call upon Heaven to record the events to be held over until Judgment Day. In other words, the State might just take the same position as Creator - so whether the End User be righteous or not, it does not matter - in the light of Policy.

Therefore, even though I will march into the fire, my King may deliver me or not, it is up to my King. ALL THINGS are under the feet of Jesus Christ - ALL THINGS. Thus the witness.

Where two or more are gathered in my name....Class Action.

Mat 18:15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.

Mat 18:16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.

Mat 18:17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.

Mat 18:18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Mat 18:19 Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.

Mat 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

All offices of State are Ecclesiastical. So if I go privately and am met with repugnance, then I am to go again with a witness. And then I will proceed before the Public - Class Action complaint. How am I to initiate that action - I claim in the name of Jesus Christ in and to the THING. I am a Witness to His Glory.


Shalom Brethren,
Michael Joseph

Perhaps another alternative... depending upon your True Bill. See example claim below:
http://broadmind.org/uploads/AMY_FIN...v_DFCS__1_.doc

[martin earl]

An ART III class action? Those demanding redemption per 12 USC 411 are the smallest minority for sure!
Also, there has never been a case involving this minority group, so the assertion by the IRS the stand we take is "frivolous" is patently false.

It has long been my standing we do NOT receive recognition from the Treasury department for our demand (thus no proper representation nor enforcement for the US/state/irs when it violates the laws of the land against us).

The METRO is rouge and its the fault of the Treasury for violating its fiduciary duty to recognise the minority group demanding redemption per 12 USC 411 and it needs to be stopped.

So how do we proceed?

[martin earl]

I am seriously considering a class action lawsuit against the IRS. Will the judge be willing to overturn the law? What I mean is this:

Job 10:15 If I be wicked, woe unto me; and if I be righteous, yet will I not lift up my head. I am full of confusion; therefore see thou mine affliction;

So I find that the Name is a Person of State and therefore will the State rely upon the Policy of Necessity or will truth win out? Nevertheless, I shall remain righteous and call upon Heaven to record the events to be held over until Judgment Day. In other words, the State might just take the same position as Creator - so whether the End User be righteous or not, it does not matter - in the light of Policy.

Therefore, even though I will march into the fire, my King may deliver me or not, it is up to my King. ALL THINGS are under the feet of Jesus Christ - ALL THINGS. Thus the witness.

Where two or more are gathered in my name....Class Action.

Mat 18:15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.

Mat 18:16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.

Mat 18:17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.

Mat 18:18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Mat 18:19 Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.

Mat 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

All offices of State are Ecclesiastical. So if I go privately and am met with repugnance, then I am to go again with a witness. And then I will proceed before the Public - Class Action complaint. How am I to initiate that action - I claim in the name of Jesus Christ in and to the THING. I am a Witness to His Glory.


Shalom Brethren,
Michael Joseph

"Complaints alleging discrimination by Treasury Department employees can be filed with the Department's Office of Inspector General (OIG). Complaints alleging discrimination by any other Treasury Department employees can also be filed with the OIG.
Office of Internal Affairs
U.S. Customs Service
U.S. Department of the Treasury
P.O. Box 14475
1200 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW
Washington, DC 20044
1-877-422-2557 (24 hours/day)
202-927-1016
202-927-4607 (fax)

http://www.customs.gov/travel/cmplnt.htm

Office of the Inspector General
U.S. Department of the Treasury
740 15th St NW, Suite 500
Washington, DC 20220
1-800-359-3898
202-927-5799 (fax)
http://www.treas.gov/oig/ (click on "Hotline" for contact information).

I will gladly file the complaint, would any like to help me write it?
There must be someone with law of the land authority at the treasury, they still coin money there and account for currency not subject to the national debt limit, someone has to be in charge of the trust set up in 1933 and oversee the gold coin which was seized by the "New deal", I would think that is the responsible party we need to talk to.

Shall we take a trip to their office under peaceful negotiations for a redress of grievances and high crimes and misdemeanors against us? I will go!